UFOs - The Disclosure Project:Sirius

[Gaybutton]

this should make you scratch your head.

What makes me scratch my head is the idea that you actually accept this crackpot "evidence." Dr. Mitchell lost me within the first two minutes when he said he won't name names. None of the crackpots ever do. Everything has to be shhhhhhh - a big secret. Read about Dr. Mitchell and then tell me all about how he's not a crackpot: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgar_Mitchell . And then hearing about how the government threatened them that something really bad would happen if they ever tell about it. Ok, then the next two logical questions - since some have told about it anyway, why has nothing happened to them? Maybe it was just idle threats. Second logical question - Who threatened them? Why and under what authority? Dozens of people - and not just in the USA, but anywhere in the entire world where "evidence" of aliens has been discovered - have been ordered by their governments to keep silent and most of them have kept silent? Do you actually believe that? Do you know of any cases in which anyone who revealed their "evidence" was ever arrested for having done so? Do you think it's even possible to keep this sort of thing a secret? Do you believe the so-called reasons why governments will stop at nothing to show the world that aliens really do exist?

Conehead skulls are nothing new either. Photos of humans afflicted with it can easily be found on the internet.

I think you believe all this nonsense not because it's credible evidence, but because you want it to be true. I want to be able to believe it too. As I said, I'd like nothing more than to see that real proof has been discovered that life exists elsewhere.

Chromosome and DNA evidence? Any crackpot can make charts. Find me other valid experts in the field who have also personally examined and tested this"evidence" and also drew the conclusion that it's aliens and then I might start to change my tune.

How about this one - much of the alien "evidence" stems from lights in the sky. Please explain to me why alien spacecraft would display lights. What do they even need lights for in the first place? Why don't they land? Did they travel all the way here from wherever they came from just to display a light show and then bye-bye?

Until there are real, universally acceptable answers within the scientific community - el cracko potto . . .

[RichLB]

I guess the term "true non-believer" may be appropriate here. You ask for credible witnesses, yet reject astronauts, ex presidents, other elected officials, air line pilots, police, army officers, radar operators, and thousands of residents of several world cities. You dismiss scientific evidence of chromosome inconsistencies and skeletal remains. When thousands of people witness events and are corroborated by trained observers, it takes an act of faith to cling to old mental sets.
And, in reference to why such craft come equipped with lights, that one had me going for awhile. Then I realized I was making an assumption that such lights could only be to view surroundings. It's quite possible they serve another purpose. For example, they may be part of a propulsive system.
And finally, the veil of secrecy... One could argue that the systematic efforts to besmirch the character of whistle blowers could be a consequence of breaking silence. It is also likely that if anyone not well known were to leak information, they would likely disappear. You go on to ask why such an earth shaking revelation would remain secret. Several reasons come to mind. One could possibly be fear of panic (remember Orson Wells' War of the Worlds), another could be that backward engineering would provide a military advantage the government might not want made known, and still another is the disruption of the world economic system if in fact a power source other than exploiting fossil fuels economically existed. In my view, the governments of the world have never needed any good reasons to deceive the public.

[Gaybutton]

I guess the term "true non-believer" may be appropriate here.

That's the one thing you've gotten right. I have never denied these people saw what they saw. What I deny is the interpretation of what they saw as alien space ships. Nobody, not even the actual witnesses, can be sure of just what they saw - with the exception of the crackpot assumption that it must have been alien spaceships.

Part of a propulsion system? I guess they must not have turned on the system until they got here because nobody saw any lights until they were a few miles from the Earth's surface. Right . . .

You might believe the governments of the world got together and swore any alien discoveries would be kept a deep, dark secret. I don't believe that for one second. The USA is not the only country where "aliens" have been observed or crashes reported, but it's all shhhhhh, a secret. Don't tell anybody. We all might panic. Meanwhile billions of dollars are spent trying to find life elsewhere. According to what you're saying, if they ever actually discover life elsewhere, they better keep it a secret. And let's not disrupt the flow of fossil fuels, despite the fact that we're running out of it and it costs a fortune. Let's keep alien energy sources secret. Wouldn't want to put those oil companies out of business, stop pollution, stop further global warming, stop further destruction of the ozone layer - you know, little unimportant things like that. No, it's better to keep it all a secret because the nuclear weapons don't already provide enough of an advantage and it's a much better idea to use the technology to create secret weapons for military use. It would sure be great to have things like that so we can just zap North Korea . . .


They don't call it the Lunatic Fringe for nuthin'

[RichLB]

It's amazing how ignorance (ie, I just don't know) can serve as an excuse for not believing. I won't bother to go through the array of evidence again - it just doesn't get through to you and you continue to label that which you disbelieve as nonsense. As to the lights, I don't claim to know what they could be used for, but a navigation system, signaling device, early preparation for eventual public visitation, or as I said before a propulsion system (grin - haven't you watched the Enterprise move through space?).
Now, as to governmental cover ups... The US government has been caught with its pants down many times (I suppose there are still people who believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, someone must believe the US Army sent a fleet of covered trucks to cart off a weather balloon at Roswell, and maybe there really were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq). The motivations for governments to maintain secrecy are obvious. And the notion that the world is eager to abandon oil, while the oil companies have a stranglehold on the world's governments, is at best naive. Alternative sources of energy seem to be quashed as soon as they begin development. Huge profits are hard to give up.

[Gaybutton]

It's amazing how ignorance (ie, I just don't know) can serve as an excuse for not believing.

From where I sit, you are using precisely the same thing as an excuse for believing. What you see as believable, I see as nonsense coming from crackpots. Most scientists accept the idea that there are at least as many stars in the universe as there are grains of sand on every beach in the entire world. And yet we were found, visited, crashed upon, kidnapped, and mated with. And the mating took place hundreds or even thousands of years ago. I don't know why they stopped. If their DNA is compatible with ours, maybe a dose of Viagra would help them.

No matter how they got here, the aliens must have put in quite an effort to do that. Maybe that's a good thing. After all, now that they have so much invested in visiting us, maybe they'll push the next killer asteroid out of the way.

My ignorance will come to an end as soon as the scientific community - the scientists who are not part of the crackpot lunatic fringe - agrees that alien visitations are genuine. Until then, I'll have to go through life remaining just as ignorant as all those foolish scientists who just don't know an alien when they see one . . .

[RichLB]

Although interest in this thread appears to have waned, I thought those interested might want to check out the following:





I'd be interested to read responses if they go beyond "crackpot" and "true believer". The video presents a rather compelling case for UFOs and addresses several of the questions which have been posed here.

[Gaybutton]

Although interest in this thread appears to have waned

No, my interest did not wane. For me there was a brief pause for a few days while the aliens had kidnapped me . . .

[shamahan]

This long thread made me really envious. You, guys, have so much free time on your hands to entertain a long discussion about nothing: it is a fact that Gaybutton is from Sirius and his only mission on this planet is to protect his motherland against any kind of disclosure projects...

[Gaybutton]

it is a fact that Gaybutton is from Sirius and his only mission on this planet is to protect his motherland against any kind of disclosure projects...

Damn! You figured me out . . .

[shamahan]

On a more serious note, here is my two cents. A couple of years ago there was an article of scientists I believe from NASA who argued that the possible contact
with another civilization could be fatal for Earthlings. The reasoning goes as follows. To be able to reach the Earth their spaceship should be able to travel
with the speed exceeding the speed of light, something which is prohibited by the theory of relativity. There is no experimental evidence that this is possible either. Some time ago a group of physicists claimed that they discovered the particle moving faster than light but it has never been confirmed. Einstein's general theory of relativity does not strictly prohibit the time travel and that opens the back door to very long distance space travel.. However, a civilization that could master such a possibility (if it is possible at all) should be much more advanced than our own. For them the interaction with Earthlings would be similar to our contact with rain worms (and that is quite flattering to the former). The only reason for advanced civilization to visit the Earth would be if they needed some natural resource from our planet and then humans would be an annoyance at best. From the point of view of above mentioned article, the programs that broadcast the information about our planet to the "rest of the Universe" are therefore extremely dangerous for us...
There is a serious research program which identifies planets with conditions similar to ours and where the life based on the same chemical structures as our own
is possible. They discovered a number of such planets and from purely statistical viewpoint, there are probably a lot of worlds with life forms similar to ours.
But the very fact that our civilization still exists is probably the best proof that we have never been contacted before.