What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post Reply
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

ceejay wrote: Thu Jan 07, 2021 7:50 pm Clearly, sadly, the USA has problems deeper than can be solved by merely getting rid of Trump.
I hope that poll is inaccurate, but if not, it wouldn't surprise me. The fact that Trump was ever elected in the first place tells me the USA has huge problems and I hope Biden can at least begin to heal a very difficult situation.

I dislike some of the news media referring to what happened today as a breach. A breach? This was flat out insurrection and I hope every one of the people who participated in it are caught and prosecuted. I wonder how many of them are Trump's neo Nazis - you know - the ones Trump says are fine people.

The damage Trump has done in 4 years is just incredible.


"The world was collectively sick in those years - and still is."
- Dame Edith Evans (Dr. Parmentier), 'QB VII'

"This is not a good war. Its purpose is dark."
- Curt Jurgens (von Stolberg), 'The Enemy Below'
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

As insane as this incident was, I hope it serves to wake up the Republicans to just what kind of man they have been so staunchly following and supporting for the last 4 years. Trump's own people are abandoning him right and left. Even Twitter and Facebook have locked him out. Good! Finally!

Even though he has only a few days left in office, I hope they oust him right now. If for no other reasons it would prevent him from causing even more damage, would (hopefully) prevent him from being able to get away with pardoning himself, and would make it possible to arrest and criminally charge him.

I have a feeling the FBI won't have much difficulty identifying the morons who actually participated in raiding the Capitol. I have no doubt that nearly every one of them already have criminal records.

Did these utter idiots actually believe they could invade America's seat of government and get away with it? Maybe they did. They are probably expecting Trump to issue some sort of a blanket pardon for all of them and I wouldn't be surprised if Trump tries to do just that - but only if he sees something in it for himself.

Here is Trump trying to weasel his way out of what he instigated in the first place:



BULLSHIT! Do you really expect people to swallow your garbage?

If Trump is allowed to get away with this, what's next?


"This tyrant, whose sole name blisters our tongues, was once thought honest"
- Malcolm, 'Macbeth'

"Did you truly believe 500 years of Rome could so easily be handed over to the clutches of a mob?"
- Sir Laurence Olivier (Crassus), 'Spartacus'
Dodger
Posts: 1926
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:58 am
Has thanked: 133 times
Been thanked: 479 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Dodger »

There's a very bright horizon ahead for America (and its allies).

After surviving 4 years of Trump's unbridled madness, I believe a calming relief will come the majority of Americans (yes, even the majority of Republican's who aren't radicalized), as well as a relief to the World in general.

The riots that Trump orchestrated at the Capitol yesterday actually backfired on him and became the last nail in his coffin. He's now faced with the possibility of another impeachment, which, if invoked, would prevent him from being able to run for office again, or the 25th amendment which would end his powers immediately. Knowing this, he finally, out of total desperation, released his concession to Biden's win in this mornings news release and has committed to supporting a peaceful transfer of power going forward (see GB's posted video above). The bastard is smart enough to know when his last card has been played.

His self-centered and insane actions since Nov 3 just cost the Republican's control of the Senate...Facebook and Twitter have canceled his accounts, thus, sticking mud in the muzzle of his gun for the remainder of his presidency and possibly beyond, key Republicans, including the snake-in-the-grass Lindsey Graham, have bailed on him, his Vice President has given him the middle finger, White House staff are abandoning ship, his rioters are now being arrested facing felony charges, and the dead supporters he called-to-arms will be buried unceremoniously. And, as shown in the video GB posted above, is now highlighting himself as the coward he is by throwing his supporters, that he himself called to arms, under the bus. I think his base going forward will only consist of his family members (maybe) and Rudy Gulliani - who'll probably have to make another trip to Jiffy Lube when this is all cover to re-color his hair.

The Military has been called in to protect the Capitol for the next 30 days. This includes 2,600 national guards from 5 surrounding States (and DC), the construction of a non-scalable fence around the capitol, and heightened security provided by other government agencies (some invisible). So there should be no concern about security.

As far as concerns that many have regarding the next 12 days, all I can say is this; There has never been a higher level of security concern in our own government than there is right now, and after the events this week, Trump can't wipe his ass in the bathroom without those tasked with monitoring him knowing exactly how many sheets he used - and which hand he used to flush the toilet. I have to believe that all bases are covered. As far as Trump having the "nuclear codes"... which has the hair raised on some people's backs right now - not a concern. They probably never even gave the deranged idiot the real codes to begin with...he wouldn't know how to administer the process of using them if he did have them, and would lose his life trying.

Trump did accomplish one thing: He distracted the peoples attention away from, what should have been, the top stories of the week, e.g. the Warnock & Ossoff victories in the Senate, and the Biden & Harris victories in the White House. That he did do. It cost him. More than I believe he's intelligent enough to comprehend at this point, but it cost him big.

Scaramucci, as much as I detest the man, explained it best when interviewed yesterday: He said that Trump's fight after losing the election had a lot to do with his deranged sociopathic and narcistic personality, although, he felt that the primary reason was Trumps fear of conviction after losing the presidential shield that's he's held close to his chest for the last 4 years. I tend to agree.

The attack on the U.S. Capitol, which Trump orchestrated, will remain etched in the memories of Americans (all Americans) forever. There is no erasing it. In the eyes of the World, the sitting U.S. President is responsible for attempting a coup to dislodge a legal democratic election and remain in power, which puts him in the same category as all the other infamous dictators who have their stories etched in the history books.

In summary: Trump has defeated himself. U.S. Democracy has been proved to be immovable. The numbers of people supporting this unmasked dictator will decrease substantially over time...and life will go on.

Everything above is fact-based. below is just my opinion:

I don't think Trump will be impeached or the 25th amendment invoked. Too much distraction. I think they'll probably opt to just contain him for security reasons and ride out the clock.

The two politicians who have impressed me the most through this past 4 years of shock waves and unprecedented turmoil are actually, and as much as it irks me saying this, two Republicans, Mitch McConnel and Mike Pence. They are both masters of the "long game" when Trump didn't even know how to play the "short game" in U.S. politics. They both brought the hammer down at the last defining moment, at a time when Trump was totally defenseless over the moves, when their moves would have the most impact on the end-game results. Checkmate! I'm not saying I appreciate the platforms they sit on, because I don't. But I do applaud their gamesmanship.

Another Republican who's gained my respect is Mitt Romney.

Snakes like Ted Cruz, Josh Howley, and others, who went on to vote against the states electoral votes, and double-down on their positions even after the Capitol was breached by Trumps rioters, will watch their political careers crumble before their very eyes. What goes around - comes around, as they say.

Just focusing on "Reality" on not on Trumps "Fake Reality", things couldn't have turned out any better in my opinion. The Democrats have won the White House, the House of Representatives and the Senate, in a clean sweep. The pandemic in America will begin to be reacted to in a painful but effective manner beginning immediately on Jan 20, and provisions to start rebuilding alliances with key allies to facilitate higher levels of national security have already been put in the works.

I've learned more about U.S. politics in the last 3 months than I have in my lifetime, and will be glad to unplug myself in 12 more days.

Go Biden!
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

Dodger wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:09 pm Trump can't wipe his ass in the bathroom without those tasked with monitoring him knowing exactly how many sheets he used - and which hand he used to flush the toilet.
I agree with most of what Dodger posted, but I do take exception with this part - mainly because I'm not so sure Trump even does wipe his ass or flush the toilet. I'm not so sure he shits at all. He's so full of shit that it's all dispersed through the words coming out of his mouth, not his ass. When Trump speaks, I believe you're not hearing words. You're hearing shit . . .
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

The obvious question is why Trump would be trying to see if he can really pardon himself if he thinks he has not broken any laws. I can't imagine it would hold up in court, even if it makes it to the Supreme Court. If it is upheld in court, that would set a precedent that a president can commit literally any federal crime and then simply pardon himself for it. Bill Barr already set a precedent that a sitting president cannot be charged, let alone prosecuted. I can't imagine that standing up in court either if it ever again becomes an issue.

But suppose Trump really can get away with pardoning himself? That pardon would not extend to state crimes and it certainly looks to me that at least New York and now Georgia might go after him. He also can't pardon himself against lawsuits filed against him.

His major downfall is his own doing by inciting the Capitol riot. Even if he can get away with it, many of his powerful supporters - or should I say former powerful supporters - are abandoning and distancing themselves from Trump.

The body count is up to 5 now - all thanks to you, Trump. Satisfied?

In other words - Donald Trump, you made a BIG mistake.
_________________________________________________

Trump asking aides and lawyers about self-pardon power

By Pamela Brown and Jeremy Diamond, CNN

January 8, 2021

(CNN) - President Donald Trump has been asking aides and lawyers, including White House counsel Pat Cipollone, about his self-pardon power, multiple sources told CNN.

Some of those conversations have happened in recent weeks, one of the sources says. It is unclear if it has come up since Wednesday's mayhem at the Capitol building fomented by the President's rhetoric or after his recent controversial call with the Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger. Trump has asked about the legal and political consequences of a self-pardon, according to a source close to Trump.

The New York Times reported earlier Thursday that Trump has suggested in conversations since Election Day that he wants to pardon himself, citing two people familiar with the discussions.

He has also asked for legal opinions on whether he has the authority to issue a self-pardon and has been advised on the potential political fallout. This person said it was not yet clear whether the President would follow through with a pardon for himself.

Another person said it is not in the works in the White House counsel's office currently but that doesn't mean it won't happen or that the Department of Justice Office of Legal Counsel is not currently reviewing the matter.

CNN has previously reported Trump has been asking aides since 2017 about his self-pardon power and has been "obsessed" with the idea. Recently, Trump allies such as Sean Hannity on Fox News have suggested publicly that he should do it. Trump has also tweeted that he believes he has the power to do so.

"As has been stated by numerous legal scholars, I have the absolute right to PARDON myself, but why would I do that when I have done nothing wrong?" the President said in 2018.

Still, a presidential self-pardon is untested and experts are divided on its constitutionality. A Justice Department legal memo says the president cannot pardon himself but he can step down and ask his vice president to take over and pardon him. However, that memo is not binding.

CNN legal analyst Elie Honig noted last year that a self-pardon would likely trigger a series of legal challenges seeking to undo the maneuver.
"A prosecutor first would have to indict Trump, notwithstanding the self-pardon. Then the issue would be litigated in the courts, likely up to the Supreme Court. Given the weight of the constitutional and historical authority (including the Justice Department opinion and the stated intent of the Framers), a self-pardon likely would not stand; but there's almost no downside to Trump in at least giving it a shot and seeing if it sticks," Honig wrote in July.

"A meager shield is better than no shield at all," he said.

Trump has largely used his broad clemency powers on criminals who are loyalists, well-connected or adjacent to his family. He's also largely ignored the established government process to review and recommend clemency requests, instead relying on the word of friends, donors and Fox News hosts.
Last month, he announced a wave of high-profile pardons including for long-time ally Roger Stone, former campaign chairman Paul Manafort and White House senior adviser Jared Kushner's father, Charles.

While all presidents issue controversial pardons at the end of their terms, Trump has moved at a faster pace than his predecessors, demonstrating little inhibition for rewarding his friends and allies using one of the most unrestricted powers of his office.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/07/poli ... index.html
Dodger
Posts: 1926
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:58 am
Has thanked: 133 times
Been thanked: 479 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Dodger »

Gaybutton wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 3:20 pm But suppose Trump really can get away with pardoning himself?
I've been kicking this around myself ever since the Muller investigation, and it appears that even the constitutional scholars haven't had to cross this bridge so far...so it's anybody's guess.

I really believe that Trumps greatest fear is not facing federal charges, but charges he's facing in New York with the Manhattan District Attorney's Office, specifically Manhattan DA Cy Vance, who is apparently waiting for the afternoon of Jan 20 to launch his attack going for Trumps jugular vein.

According to several press releases which were released back during the time of the Muller investigation, Vance had already obtained 10 years of Trump tax filings (gee, I wonder how a copy of those got to the Desk at the New York Times?), the financial books from the Trump Organization, and other incriminating evidence to bring up charges of; falsifying business records, tax evasion, criminal tax fraud, money laundering, and possibly others. The crimes Vance is investigating carry penalties ranging from huge financial penalties to imprisonment. These crimes are not limited just to Donald, but to his family members involved with the operations of the Trump Organization as well.

It's impossible for Trump to pardon himself from these crimes...he knows they're waiting for him...losing the election means the statute of limitations will not have expired on these crimes, thus the source of his insane acts of desperation over losing the election...which just may serve to be the final chapter in the Trump Story.

I mentioned the name Cy Vance in another post on this topic 5-6 months ago, and have been following this like a hawk. I'm becoming convinced (right or wrong) that Vance could become a central figure in the final downfall of Trump. Fingers crossed!

Elect an underworld conman from The Queens as President of the United States. What could ever go wrong?

Here's a bit about Cy Vance:

https://www.manhattanda.org/about-the-o ... -cy-vance/
Jun

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Jun »

Ideally Trump would drop dead, as fast as possible.

I don't normally wish death upon anyone, but Trump is such a danger that having him permanently removed from contention would be the best outcome.

Actually, in common with North Korea, the US has a habit of passing the job on to relatives of past leaders. So seeing the back of the entire clan would be preferable.
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

Thai coup history shows why Trump’s attempt was destined to fail

By Barry Kenyon

January 9, 2021

On nearly any definition there was an attempted coup d’etat in Washington DC on January 6, 2021. Certainly a lawfully elected president attempted to prolong his grip on power by promoting illegal and violent means. For the first time since 1814, when British troops went on a burning expedition, the “cradle of American democracy” escaped the same fate by a hair’s breadth. But success for Trump was always near-impossible.

Thai political history since 1932 provides most of the answers. A successful coup primarily requires the collective army leadership either to engineer the putsch or to support it. Thailand has experienced 20 attempted coups with 12 succeeding in toppling the government of the day. The eight which failed all had one common element: a divided military as instanced in several futile attempts in the 1980s against premier Prem Tinsulanonda. The last three successful coups – in 1991, 2006 and 2014 – were led by top army commanders and were more or less bloodless. In 2014 it was not even necessary to roll out the tanks to surround government buildings in Bangkok.

Moreover, successful coups must be imposed very quickly. Immediate control of government buildings and of media stations, at any rate in the capital city, is essential. Free movement has to be made impossible for political party leaders. The whole point of armed troops appearing in big numbers on the streets is to indicate that the drama is over and that opposition is pointless. Overnight curfews in a large country such as Thailand serve the double purpose of limiting public movement whilst ensuring that troops could be dispatched quickly on empty roads to distant provinces.

Of course, Trump’s self-coup attempt was neither engineered nor supported by the US armed forces. Indeed, the president seems to have done his best to delay the calling out of the National Guard after local police were overwhelmed by the mob breaking into the Capitol complex. We now know that the highest generals in the Pentagon were not willing to assist Trump. In recent days it has even transpired that the president, even though supreme commander, does not have control of the nuclear buttons because of military-brass fears he might act irrationally.

Thailand has experienced very few self-coups. An exception was in 1958 when Field Marshall Sarit Thanarat staged a successful coup against his own government to get rid of people he did not like. Similar self-coups occurred in the Philippines in 1982 when President Marcos declared martial law and abolished the constitution and in South Korea in 1972 when President Chung-hee did something similar. So many self-coups have occurred in Latin America that there is even a Spanish term for them: “autogolpe.”

By contrast, Trump’s failed putsch seems to owe more to the disastrous attempt in Turkey in 2016 when a group of politicians and junior military tried to remove President Erdogan. But they lacked majority support in the country, were opposed by the senior military and even failed to close down state radio and television stations in double quick time. They also overlooked the necessity to capture Erdogan who was able to communicate with all Turks through the cell phone of an assistant.

It is impossible to know what was in Trump’s mind. Maybe his plan was simply to delay the confirmation of the November 2020 election results. More likely, a better-organized and more destructive assault on the Capitol might have given him the opportunity to declare martial law and rule by decree. But his final gamble always lacked the key ingredient of support from the state’s armed forces. As the Roman emperor Nero uttered on his death bed, “You cannot rule Rome without the Praetorian Guard.” Donald Trump has obviously never read the ancient historians. Was too busy on Twitter.

https://www.pattayamail.com/news/thai-c ... ail-339938
User avatar
Gaybutton
Posts: 21459
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:21 am
Location: Thailand
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1306 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Gaybutton »

As far as I'm concerned, they can have him. And since this is the first arrest warrant issued for Trump, let's not forget - first come, first served . . .
___________________________________________

Iraqi judge issues arrest warrant for Donald Trump

By Mohammed Tawfeeq and Aqeel Najim, CNN

January 8, 2021

(CNN) - A judge in Baghdad's investigative court has issued an arrest warrant for outgoing US President Donald Trump, over the killing of an Iraqi paramilitary leader during the assassination of Iranian General Qasem Soleimani last year.

Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis -- the Iraqi deputy head of the Iran-backed Iraqi Popular Mobilization Forces -- was killed along with Soleimani in a US airstrike just over a year ago, on January 3, 2020.

"After the completion of the preliminary investigation procedures, the judge decided to issue an arrest warrant for the outgoing President of the United States of America, Donald Trump," read a statement released by the Supreme Judicial Council of Iraq on Thursday.
"The investigation procedures will continue to find out the other participants in the implementation of this crime, whether they are Iraqis or foreigners," the statement added.

The Popular Mobilization Forces (PMF) is a Shia paramilitary force made up of former militias with close ties to Iran. It was recognized under a 2016 Iraqi law as an independent military force that answers directly to the prime minister.

Iran also has an arrest warrant out for Trump in relation to Soleimani's death, the semi-official Fars news agency reported Monday.

Soleimani was the architect of a growing Iranian military presence in Iraq, Syria and Yemen as the leader of the Iran Revolutionary Guards' Quds Force, an elite unit that handles Iran's overseas operations. It is considered a foreign terrorist organization by the US.

At a fundraising dinner in Florida shortly after the strike, Trump described the operation as taking out "two for the price of one." He described Soleimani as a "noted terrorist" who "was supposed to be in his country," but did not describe an "imminent threat" that precipitated the strike authorization -- the justification given by administration officials in the aftermath of the attack.

Tehran attorney general Ali Alqasi Mehr claimed Trump would be prosecuted after his term ends, Fars reported.

Last week, a large crowd gathered in Baghdad close to midnight (local time) for a memorial service at the site where the drone strike killed Soleimani and al-Muhandis a year ago.

Images broadcast by the PMF showed a crowd of people in an area lit by candles, where tributes were broadcast on loudspeakers and attendees chanted, "God is great, America is the great Satan."

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/07/worl ... andis-intl
Dodger
Posts: 1926
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2010 2:58 am
Has thanked: 133 times
Been thanked: 479 times

Re: What becomes of Trump once he leaves office?

Post by Dodger »

Gaybutton wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 12:03 pm As far as I'm concerned, they can have him. And since this is the first arrest warrant issued for Trump, let's not forget - first come, first served
I couldn't agree more.

Then if we ever have a war with Iraq we could make sure the bombers hit the prison first.
Post Reply