Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

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Dodger
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Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Dodger » Mon Jul 22, 2019 11:19 am

Always the optimist, I see the changes we're seeing with the public boy venues closing and the soaring popularity of the on-line dating apps as presenting a clear advantage for expats going forward...considering the motto..."If you can't beat em - join em".

I'm going to preface my remarks by saying that I truly believe that remaining a Freestyle Butterfly is the best way to fly over here. Total freedom, no financial commitments beyond a tip for sex, lots of variety of boys to enjoy, without the stress of dealing with other people's financial problems. No doubt, this is the most logical approach. Those in this category are able to find an endless supply of short time companions with just a few clicks on the keyboard. Those who are more interested in finding a candidate for a long-term relationship (like myself) can also find what they're looking for, although, at least for me, a lot more patience and scrutinizing are required.

One of the great advantages of the apps that I really like is that you can set your own criteria and filter out any boys who don't match what you're interested in. The money boys are obvious. I was only interested in meeting boys who were actively employed (not sex workers), preferably professionals with college degree's or those involved in the Arts as I have a common interest in this area. I set the age range from 21 to 35. I deleted any boys responding to my messages who were more interested in hooking up with me right away versus showing any real interest in getting to know me. Believe me, over a hundred boys I had on "My Favorites" list got deleted just for that point. I never added a boy to my Favorites List, let alone sent him a message, if he looked like a movie star who's face could be gracing the cover of Dreamboy Magazine. I also filtered out a boy the minute he uttered a word about having money problems. All this filtering and I still had dozens of boys who I then started chatting with via e:mail.

For me, the patience and extra effort I put into this certainly paid dividends. The boy I was fortunate enough to link up with is as honest and sincere as they come....earns his own modest income as a fashion designer...takes pride in being self-sufficient...had a strong preference for older men hoping to meet a farang from Europe...(opp's, I missed the boat on that one), only interested in a monogamous relationship, and considers "the orgasm" as being the most rewarding and enjoyable aspect of life, which, of course, I couldn't agree with more.

Also...I only used Planet Romeo for my search, which, according to what others say, is lacking behind some of the other apps like Blue'd, Grinder, Hornet, etc.

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by fountainhall » Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:10 pm

I do agree with much of Dodger's advice. Unless Mr. Right already exists, for those relatively new to Thailand and starting their retirement here, hoping to find a much younger Mr. Right is a lot less easy than it used to be. Cash to finance a commercial boy from the bars/apps will be necessary as will a huge dollop of patience. Allied to patience will be a way of controlling jealousy. A tolerance for the many little white lies which seem part of Thai culture is also vital. And all that is before the family comes in and becomes part of your life.

A partner who can speak decent English, has his own job and really prefers to be with much older guys is the ideal. But as has already been discussed here several times, there is still a lot of inbuilt discrimination against gay Thais throughout Thailand. Many young graduates relatively new to their jobs do not want their colleagues and elders to know they are gay. Their career prospects can be affected if it is generally known they are gay, the more so if living with or a partner of a much older farang, Of course there are exceptions, but these are not easy to find. They generally do not frequent the farang bars and clubs and are reluctant to give too much information if they find their way on to the apps.

So the butterfly route is perhaps an ideal. Yet, some of us reach a point where shagging around loses much of the excitement it once had and we long for a more stable form of partnership and companionship. That, I suggest, is when it often becomes quite difficult.

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Gaybutton » Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:10 pm

This is a perfect time for me to once again repeat my favorite quote:

"If you want love in Thailand, rent it."
- Richard Burk

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Dodger » Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:15 pm

fountainhall wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 12:10 pm
A partner who can speak decent English, has his own job and really prefers to be with much older guys is the ideal. But as has already been discussed here several times, there is still a lot of inbuilt discrimination against gay Thais throughout Thailand. Many young graduates relatively new to their jobs do not want their colleagues and elders to know they are gay. Their career prospects can be affected if it is generally known they are gay, the more so if living with or a partner of a much older farang, Of course there are exceptions, but these are not easy to find. They generally do not frequent the farang bars and clubs and are reluctant to give too much information if they find their way on to the apps.
There was a time when I didn't think this was the case, but went on to learn that it's exactly as you stated.

This was the case with several of the gay professionals I was interacting with, as they seemed somewhat guarded in their responses with a hint of paranoia. The exception to this being the younger guys who were still attending college and looking for ways to get their tuition money. No hesitation or guarded responses there whatsoever... :lol:

These conversations always seem directed at Butterflies, Sugar Daddies, and Long-Term Relationships, but there's another life style category which gets very little attention, and that's the lifestyle of a "Sugar Daddy Butterfly". Yes, I know this label sounds ridiculous, but there are many very seasoned expats who have gravitated to this life style, who, to put it bluntly, appear to be living lives of pure misery. The Sugar Daddy Butterfly is someone who is providing financial support to multiple boys simultaneously, similar to having multiple boyfriend type arrangements, while still playing the field in the role of a freestyle butterfly. Those in this category almost always appear stressed over financial problems, and for good reason, as the boys in this scenario are robbing him blind...he knows it...and can't or won't do anything to change it.

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by windwalker » Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:02 am

Dodger, I don't see where you mentioned the scenario where Sugar Daddy falls in lust, has a large, public wedding and then, has a speedy divorce. :twisted:

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Dodger » Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:26 am

windwalker wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:02 am
Dodger, I don't see where you mentioned the scenario where Sugar Daddy falls in lust, has a large, public wedding and then, has a speedy divorce. :twisted:
I'm sorry. It appears I may have inadvertently struck a nerve.

I assume your talking about the wedding I had in Pattaya back in 2011 (I think) which ended so abruptly, as there was no divorce involved with my first marriage in Thailand.

I was introduced to a 23 year old monk from Nakhon Phenom while he was on sabbatical and visiting relatives in Pattaya. His father, who had recently passed away, was a wealthy farang from Holland, and his mother, who became the beneficiary of his estate, encouraged her son to take leave from the temple where he had spent the last 19 years to explore life outside the monk hood. Our meeting came at a time where my boyfriend (and husband) of 8 years had just lost his life to tuberculosis while serving a prison sentence for possession of drugs.

We had non-stop sex for about a week...saw our meeting as some sort of predetermined destiny...decided to tie the knot...hosted a street a party (Undaunted and others will recall)...and 10 days later I was back in the U.S. working. When I returned 3 months later he had blown over 85,000 baht which he refused to account for...turned my apartment into a zoo with urine stains all over the bed, sofa and walls from two untrained lap dogs...and decided that coming straight with me and telling me the truth just wasn't going to be in the cards. I asked him to pack his bags and hit the road.

This is just one example of the mistakes, mishaps and calamities I've been involved with during my adventures in LaLa Land. Believe me, there have been many many others, although, and as ridiculous as this may sound, regrets of any substance are few are far between.

Ironically, I'm writing a book right now which touches on this very same subject. Not that anyone would want to read it - even if it were intended for anyone else to read. I'm just writing. A few nights ago I took a few minutes to sit back and read the last chapter I had written which describes some of my more memorable antics in Thailand during the 2000 - 20004 period. Right in the middle of my reading I found myself laughing hysterically and just blurted out..."You Crazy Mother Fucker". Jay, who was sitting 10 feet away sketching one of his designs, just smiled and shook his head.

Life is an Adventure - not a Destiny!

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Gaybutton » Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:55 am

Dodger wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:26 am
This is just one example of the mistakes, mishaps and calamities I've been involved with during my adventures in LaLa Land.

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by werner99 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:30 am

Dodger wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:26 am

Ironically, I'm writing a book right now which touches on this very same subject. Not that anyone would want to read it - even if it were intended for anyone else to read. I'm just writing.

Life is an Adventure - not a Destiny!
Dodger, you write extremely well and have had such an interesting and unusual life. I, for one, would be VERY interested in reading your book.

Perhaps you could publish parts of it in installments on this forum....

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by fountainhall » Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:43 pm

werner99 wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:30 am
Dodger, you write extremely well and have had such an interesting and unusual life. I, for one, would be VERY interested in reading your book.

Perhaps you could publish parts of it in installments on this forum....
I happily second Werner's comments.

A few years ago I had one very different experience with a guy who had a good job as a professional. He clicked on me on one of the apps - cannot recall which one. We chatted for a while, he was in his late 20s, his English was excellent and he made it clear it would be nice to meet. Since I like to meet someone and get to know just a little more about him before going to the next step, I suggested dinner. He was working on Thonglor, had his own car and suggested we meet close by on Sukhumvit. He took me to a lovely nearby Thai restaurant in an old Thai House. After dinner he then drove me to my home and suggested we could meet the next day.

I was delighted. Over the next few evenings we spent quite a lot of time together although he always had to leave because he started work at 8:00 each morning. Once he asked if I could join him at a small dental clinic as he had to have root canal treatment. He was quite terrified of the procedure and needed some moral support!

At the weekends we'd have lunch and dinner together and maybe see a movie before he would come and spend the night. After a few weeks I really believed I had found my Mr. Right. We seemed to click so well together. Then, the next Saturday we saw a movie in Terminal 21. Surprisingly, for it had not happened before, he put his arm in mine as soon as the lights went down and held it close for the duration. As we were going down the escalators I assumed we would perhaps wander around a bit until it was time for dinner. But as we reached a floor with an entrance to the car park, he said he was really sorry he'd have to leave as his mother needed him for something. Will I see you tomorrow, I asked? Of course, he replied.

So he opened the door to the car park. As it was almost closed, it opened again and he looked at me almost quizzically. Then he was gone. Gone for ever! When he did not call the next day, I phoned him. No reply. I looked at his app page. It was no longer there. None of my calls or messages ever received a reply. He totally vanished - and I had absolutely no idea why!

I still do not know why! Two thoughts eventually came to mind. One was that he might already be in a relationship and his partner had been away from Thailand for a few weeks. But from everything he had told me over that short time I doubted it. Far more likely, I became certain, was that he was typical of the professional guys I mentioned in an earlier post. I think he found himself getting too involved - and with a farang! - that he became scared of family and friends finding out. Whatever the reason, it made me feel no better. I was just very sad.

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Re: Finding Mr. Right - If You're So Inclined

Post by Gaybutton » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:11 pm

werner99 wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:30 am
Perhaps you could publish parts of it in installments on this forum....
If he wishes to do that, I will support it.

fountainhall wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:43 pm
Whatever the reason, it made me feel no better. I was just very sad.
This won't make you feel any better either, but you're not alone and based on your story it seems you were doing everything right. Whatever his reasons were, I doubt it was your fault.

Since you said this was a few years ago, have you recently tried contacting him again? I would try it from a telephone number he would not recognize. I think he at least owes you an explanation. If you get one, which I doubt, I would never recommend reestablishing the relationship. If it happened once, it is too much of an emotional risk that it might happen again. And since none of us are getting any younger, I, for one, don't need that kind of risk at this stage of the game.

I was directly involved with a similar story. This gentleman was a board member, but I have not heard from him for a few years and he has not visited the board or posted for a very long time.

He was involved with a Thai guy and I feel a little guilty because I'm the one who introduced them. My friend was also doing everything right. He is German. When he was in Germany he spoke with the boy regularly over the phone and was fully financially supporting him, and even supporting the boy's family. This was going on for over three years. The boy was always delighted when he would come to Thailand, would be inseparable, and often cried when my friend left to return to Germany. It turned out those were crocodile tears.

Only the night before he was returning to Thailand he spoke with the boy, who assured him he was very excited he is coming and will be there at the airport to meet him.

The boy never showed up at the airport. My friend tried to call him. No answer. He tried to call the boy's mother. The mother seemed surprised. I knew where the boy lived, so when my dumbfounded, very upset friend reached Pattaya I took him to the boy's apartment. He no longer lived there. The current resident told us he had recently moved out - with his Thai boyfriend - and he didn't know where.

Of course, my friend was shocked and I too was surprised. It took some time, but we later found out the boy had been with his Thai boyfriend almost the whole time. The boy had been stringing along my friend since day one. I had known this boy a few years before introducing them. He did not seem like the type who would ever do such a thing and I knew nothing about him having a boyfriend. Obviously I was wrong.

My friend even was making plans to retire to Thailand and live his life with this boy. Sad as it was, at least this happened before it was too late.

A couple years later we found out the boy managed to contract HIV, did not get treatment, and eventually died. I can't say I shed any tears over his death.

Unfortunately, over the years I've heard too many such stories - which is the reason I quote Richard Burk - "If you want love in Thailand, rent it."

There are, of course, relationships between aging farang and young Thai guys that work out beautifully, but as far as I can tell, the vast majority of them don't - and it's the farang who almost always is the one who ends up heartbroken - and sometimes financially broken as well.

I suggest playing it safe - very safe. Whenever such stories come up in conversation and I hear a farang referring to his boyfriend and responding by saying, "Not this boy. He's different," that's when I know the relationship is likely to end very badly - and unfortunately I've usually been right.

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