"Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

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Gaybutton
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"Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Gaybutton » Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:43 pm

Personally I have no problem about this. If my car manages to break down somewhere and I don't know how to explain where I am, a GPS tracking device could lead them right to me.

If this could help reduce speeding, I wouldn't mind that at all, but given the number of drivers that do speed, I'm not sure how that would be enforceable. I hope they'll start with the Sunee Plaza motorbike maniacs.

I don't know how this would help to stop people from driving without a proper license because as long as as driver has the owner's permission and holds a valid license, anyone can drive a privately owned vehicle. Also, unless the tracking device has a means of identifying individual cars and motorbikes, how would they have any idea that unlicensed drivers are driving anyway. I would have no objection if it somehow puts a stop to children (and morons behaving like children), nowhere near old enough to be licensed, driving motorbikes.
___________________________________________

Minister Floats Mandatory GPS for All Private Cars

By Teeranai Charuvastra

October 21, 2019

BANGKOK — The government may soon require all vehicles on the road, including private cars and motorcycles, to install tracker devices and send location data to the authorities, a minister said Monday.

Transport Minister Saksayam Chidchob said citizens must bear the cost of GPS devices and sacrifice some levels of privacy in order to keep the roads safe if the measure is approved. He said the policy would help reduce speeding and crack down on driving without proper licenses.

“If we could install GPS on all types of vehicles, we would be able to regulate every vehicle on the roads,” Saksayam told reporters. “Thailand would be the first in the world to do so.”

He continued, “Nothing is free, but we are weighing the benefits that [the new measure] could bring. I’ll consult with the Ministry of Industry within this month.”

The minister said the GPS devices would send relevant data, including vehicles’ location and speed, to a central server stored at the Department of Land Transport.

If the measure is enacted, motorists would be forced to pay up to 3,000 baht for a tracker device and an additional monthly fee of 300 baht, he said.

When a reporter asked whether privacy should also be considered, Saksayam replied, “We have to see what consequences from installing GPS might be. There could be a lot of benefits. At least, there would be fewer crimes, such as car theft. Regulating speed via GPS might also reduce accidents.”

He said public opinion would be solicited for the idea, which could take at least six months before it becomes a ministerial regulation. Saksayam added that he believed the tradeoff is worth it.

“I concede that some issues may affect civil rights, but it won’t cause much damage to them,” the minister said. “And it can lead to a reduction of accidents and losses.”

Public transport such as buses and vans are already required to have GPS devices onboard, but some operators said they could not afford to pay for the trackers.

Thailand is ranked by the World Health Organisation as the fifth highest road toll in the world, per capita. At least 11,000 people have died in road accidents so far this year, according to media reports.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/news/crim ... vate-cars/

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Dodger » Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:59 pm

Quote from the article:
He said public opinion would be solicited for the idea, which could take at least six months before it becomes a ministerial regulation. Saksayam added that he believed the tradeoff is worth it.

“I concede that some issues may affect civil rights, but it won’t cause much damage to them,” the minister said. “And it can lead to a reduction of accidents and losses.”
If public opinion is going to be the considering factor, this idiotic plan will end up in the dumpster.

The statement that these GPS trackers can reduce accidents and losses is almost laughable. What a GPS tracker can do is help to locate criminals, and of course farang drivers who have driven outside their province where the TM28 report then become mandatory.

Just 3 weeks ago we were discussing the TM28 Report and trying to figure out how they would even know if a farang traveled outside his province where a TM28 Report would be required. Probably just a coincidence... :?:

Have they ever thought about actually having the traffic police enforce the driving laws to help reduce accidents???

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Gaybutton » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:41 pm

Dodger wrote:
Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:59 pm
Have they ever thought about actually having the traffic police enforce the driving laws to help reduce accidents???
Something that makes sense? Are you kidding me?

I do like the idea that in case of emergency they could easily find you. If that app (see: https://www.gaybuttonthai.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10058 ) becomes available, that will likely take care of TM28 issues. Plus, if an identifiable GPS is installed in cars, wouldn't that negate the need for filing a TM28 since they would know where you are and when you returned home? That would be a plus.

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Undaunted » Thu Oct 24, 2019 7:04 pm

Someone’s brother-in-law must be selling this equipment, it reminds me when years ago all bars in Pattaya were told to install cameras.
"In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king"

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Dodger » Fri Oct 25, 2019 8:14 am

Quote from article:
If the measure is enacted, motorists would be forced to pay up to 3,000 baht for a tracker device and an additional monthly fee of 300 baht,
If the average Thai family has a car and 3 motorbikes it would cost them 9,000 baht for the GPS devices, and 1,200 baht per month for the privilege of being tracked which is more than an average electric bill. I wonder how many Thais are going to want this.


Quote from article:
“If we could install GPS on all types of vehicles, we would be able to regulate every vehicle on the roads,.
GPS trackers aren't intended to "regulate" anything, nor are they capable of regulating vehicles.

Quote from article:
” Saksayam told reporters. “Thailand would be the first in the world to do so.”
Another way to phrase this would have been..."No one else in the world is doing this".

Gee...I wonder if there's a reason why.

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Gaybutton » Fri Oct 25, 2019 8:57 am

I have a feeling this is yet another idea that hasn't been thought through and even if it has, it isn't going anywhere.

As for me, if they make it voluntary, I would do it.

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Gaybutton » Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:19 am

Will GPS monitoring end the carnage on our roads?

October 27, 2019

Image
A driver of a public vehicle is required to swipe a card through a GPS-linked reader, to self-verify his identify before driving.


First-time minister Saksayam Chidchob is quickly making a name for himself as a rookie politician with a never-ending store of new ideas.

Not a month has passed without the transport minister, a Bhumjaithai Party list-MP, producing a new brainchild. His ideas range from legalising taxi-hailing apps and increasing the speed limit on highways, to placing regular checkpoints along inter-provincial routes to monitor public vans.

The bold proposals have made Mr Saksayam -- the younger brother of veteran politician Newin Chidchob -- a household name. Yet some ideas have also drawn fierce opposition.

His push to legalise the Grab ride-hailing app has made him public enemy No.1 among meter-taxi drivers. Meanwhile, safety experts worry his idea to reduce car accidents by raising the highway speed limit from 80kph to 120kph may have the opposite effect.

But his latest brainchild has triggered perhaps the greatest resistance.

Last Monday, Mr Saksayam announced he is considering whether to require all privately owned vehicles, including motorcycles, to install GPS devices that can be tracked by authorities.

The GPS technology will allow a government transport agency to monitor motorists who breach the speed limit, behaviour which is blamed for the majority of road accident deaths.

Motorists and critics have complained of the financial burden of the scheme and questioned its benefits. Many have also raised concerns about privacy.

Faced with the criticism, Mr Saksayam turned to Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha for support.

According to a Transport Ministry source, the premier agreed with the GPS policy. "After weighing the pros and cons, the prime minister is on the transport minister's side. He is worried about road accidents."

Thailand has the highest road fatality rate in Asean and the ninth-highest in the world, losing 32.7 people per 100,000, according to the World Health Organisation.

The GPS dream

As of now, the GPS policy is just an idea. The transport minister has given the Department of Land Transport (DLT) one year to explore the possibility of installing the trackers in private cars and motorbikes. Currently, there are about 40 million cars and motorbikes registered with the DLT.

"It is too soon to say whether the proposal will be put into practice. And if it is adopted, we still don't know exactly how it will be implemented. The cabinet will have the final say on implementation," he said.

Mr Saksayam admitted motorists will have to shoulder a financial burden, but said GPS will gradually become more affordable.

The transport ministry estimates that each GPS device will cost about 10,000 baht, with motorists also required to pay annual maintenance costs of between 3,000 and 6,000 baht.

The ministry is studying how it can help motorists with the costs. "We still have many factors to think about, including ways to install the devices and how we can help people," he said.

Options for implementation

According to Mr Saksayam's plan, GPS technology can be used in several ways.

One option is to use it to detect motorists who breach the speed limit for two minutes or longer. The installed GPS device will then send data to the government-run server, which will issue a traffic ticket to the wrongdoer's address. Mr Saksayam apparently got the idea from other countries where it has been adopted.

However, the DLT is also exploring other methods to keep drivers in line with traffic law.

The department's GPS-embedded vehicle management centre said there are at least two systems that can help alleviate fears of privacy violations.

Critics say the GPS policy will allow the government to locate and identify drivers wherever they go. This would represent an unprecedented level of state surveillance in Thailand.

However, centre director Titipat Thaijongrak argues this does not reflect the government's actual plans for privately owned vehicles.

"We're not going to use anything like the GPS tracking system currently installed in trucks and public vehicles," he said, adding officials only want to limit driving speeds, not locate the drivers.

One option to serve this purpose is "Intelligent Speed Adaptation" (ISA) equipment, Mr Titipat said.

The technology connects with a computer network to monitor speed limits in different areas in order to control driving speeds.

Take community roads and highways as an example. Here speed limits are set at 50kph and 80kph respectively. If a car or a motorcycle exceeds the maximum speed restriction, ISA will alert the driver to slow down.

ISA is already being used in Europe, but only new cars can be equipped with the device, he said.

The other option is "Radio Frequency Identification" (RFID). It works like an Easy Pass card reader, identifying vehicles which carry the card and allowing them automatic entry to expressways.

RFID installed along roads can also read data sent from a device installed in a car or motorcycle to tell whether the driver is speeding.

Success stories

Many countries have already tested GPS technology and found it can play a significant role in ensuring safer driving.

The Australian government found that up to 89% of drivers slowed down after being alerted by ISA devices used in its pilot project, in Illawarra, New South Wales.

A similar outcome was achieved in research by the Norwegian Public Roads Administration.

The use of ISA in 2.6 million vehicles has reduced the death toll and severe injuries caused by road accidents, it said.

The device also helped cut fuel use by 4%.

However, despite the satisfactory outcomes, it remains uncertain whether authorities' commitment to the new technology will remain firm in the face of opposition and whether drivers will finally welcome it.

Is tech the solution?

Using "Big Brother" surveillance technology like GPS to monitor reckless drivers in Thailand sounds promising to some.

Transport Ministry adviser Agachai Sumalee, who is also a professor of transport systems at the Hong Kong Polytechnic University, has thrown his support behind the proposal, citing European Union studies and standards for the GPS system over the past 20 years.

For Mr Agachai, these are proof that GPS offers a new reliable solution to the chronic problem of unsafe driving in the country.

However, his opponents say the use of technology will not solve the problem at its root.

Instead, the GPS idea is merely another sign that traffic police and laws are failing to keep motorists in check, they say.

"I don't believe the GPS technology can change behaviour and force Thai drivers to be more disciplined," said Chaiwat Ketsom, who has driven a car and ridden a motorcycle for the past five years.

"Currently there are speed cameras installed all across Bangkok, but many drivers still don't respect laws. They even ignore traffic tickets."

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/sp ... our-roads-

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Dodger » Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:00 pm

Quotes from article:

...But his latest brainchild has triggered perhaps the greatest resistance.

Last Monday, Mr Saksayam announced he is considering whether to require all privately owned vehicles, including motorcycles, to install GPS devices that can be tracked by authorities.

The GPS technology will allow a government transport agency to monitor motorists who breach the speed limit, behaviour which is blamed for the majority of road accident deaths.

Meanwhile, safety experts worry his idea to reduce car accidents by raising the highway speed limit from 80kph to 120kph may have the opposite effect.
It's almost impossible to read some of this stuff without laughing my ass off. First this guy acknowledges "speeding" as being the leading cause of road accidents, and then launches the brilliant idea to increase the speed limit to reduce accidents. It just doesn't get any better than this... :lol:

The first article said the GPS devices would cost around 3,000 baht. This article says 10,000 baht. Just too funny!

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Gaybutton » Sun Oct 27, 2019 1:51 pm

Dodger wrote:
Sun Oct 27, 2019 12:00 pm
This article says 10,000 baht. Just too funny!
Save the laughter for the day you have to lay out that 10,000 baht.

I wonder if this will apply to those motorbike-with-sidecar vendors whose vehicles couldn't exceed speed limits if they wanted to.

What will be the penalties for those who get caught driving and didn't install the device . . . ?

For a great many Thais 10,000 baht is more than they make in a month. And a great many are paying back loans for their motorbikes and can barely afford even that. Where do they think these people are going to be able to come up with 10,000 baht for this? And these people are supposed to pay annual maintenance costs of between 3,000 and 6,000 baht on top of that?

Actually, this really would reduce vehicle accidents because a hell of a lot of vehicle owners won't be able to afford to be on the road at all.

According to the article, there are currently over 21,000,000 motorbikes on the road in Thailand, let alone cars, trucks, etc. Let's see - 21,000,000 x 10,000 = 210,000,000,000. 210 billion baht, roughly the equivalent of US $7,000,000,000.

Another thoroughly and well thought through idea - courtesy of "Welcome to Thailand."

If this really does become law, whose brother-in-law gets to be the supplier?

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Re: "Big Brother" for cars and motorbikes - maybe

Post by Jun » Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:36 pm

The idea is barking mad.

For a start, anyone intending to commit a severe crime would disconnect or hack the device.
Monitoring traffic would be better done by a network of roadside cameras, which is what I believe other countries do.

Normal people would find 300 baht a month to be expensive, particularly if on the 330 baht a day minimum wage.

Also, the Thai government seems to have some sort of inexplicable interest in closely monitoring and tracking everyone. They seem to have missed the point that the first people they should be monitoring is their own corrupt police force. Converting that from a bribe collecting machine to a policing unit would be a good start.

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