What is average spending by tourists in Thailand

[Gaybutton]

I also believe that the latest paranoia of the Thai government will reduce drastically the number of Westerns coming/staying at Thailand .

None of this makes any sense. Thailand wants tourists and I would think also wants retirees with the means to support themselves and contributing to the Thai economy by spending their money here. All these rules and regulations, along with the difficulty and confusion in complying with them results in precisely the opposite.

And why? According to what I've read, it's supposed to reduce crime and reduce money laundering. Just how many tourists are committing crimes and laundering money? How many retirees are committing crimes and laundering money? If those numbers are really high enough to justify all this nonsense, then I'd say the problem is neither tourists nor retirees. The problem is their own incompetence in law enforcement, detective work, and police work. You don't solve these kinds of problems by blaming the wrong people and penalizing innocent people.

[ISAC69]

You don't solve these kinds of problems by blaming the wrong people and penalizing innocent people.

Exactly. The Thai government is targeting the wrong people. All this nonsense will not affect any person who wants to commit crimes or launder
money and the innocent ones who want to retire peacefully without all this stupid bureaucracy will move on to other countries, there are lots of clips at YouTube showing Pattaya is empty.

[Gaybutton]

there are lots of clips at YouTube showing Pattaya is empty.

I almost wish that was the case, but living in Pattaya I can tell you Pattaya is not empty at all. Maybe some of the tourist areas are, but the rest of Pattaya - very crowded and huge traffic jams. I don't know who is saying Pattaya is empty, but if they were seeing what I'm seeing, there is no way they would say that.

[ISAC69]

I meant tourist areas.

[Gaybutton]

I meant tourist areas.

I've noticed in Pattaya most of my favorite restaurants that ended up closing, boys complaining about lack of customers, bar closings, etc. - almost all of that has been happening in the tourist areas. To me, that demonstrates the significant drop in tourist numbers and I think further backs up the problems caused by the strong baht and many of the problems immigration policies are causing.

If I was planing a tourist holiday, I wouldn't want to go to a place where my money is worth half of what it was worth just a few years ago, prices double what they were just a few years ago, and a place where the authorities want to watch me just like Big Brother - along with still being told what time to go to bed by the very same people who only a few weeks ago said they are going to abolish that, but still have done nothing - along with polluted beaches, beach restrictions, polluted air, etc.

There would have to be a very good reason for me to go to such a place for a holiday rather than choosing somewhere else to go. If it wasn't for the availability of the boys, I wonder if any gays would be going to Thailand anymore.

Thailand needs to make major environmental improvements and get off this kick about absurd immigration policies and over-regulation - and fast - or I believe their tourist industry is going to be hit hard to the point that the industry hangs on by a thread or eventually goes under completely.

Remember when Pattaya was going to change the paradigm and become a family holiday spot? It hasn't quite worked out that way.

[Jun]

Bars are probably closing due to a variety of factors. Probably worthy of it's own thread. Competition from phone apps is cause number 1 in my view. Other factors might be a strong baht and perhaps the boys are not quite as cute to some eyes as 10 years ago. The typical bar boy is covered in tatoos, has a Borat moustache and might be a few kg heavier than 10 years ago. So more filtering is needed for some of us.

Yes, the Pound buys just over half as many baht as ~12 years ago, but for most things prices have not doubled in local Thai currency. The main change is the exchange rates. Thai inflation is low from what I see. Costs for hotels, transport, food etc are only a few % up on 10 years ago.
Low inflation is prevalent in developed and emerging economies these days (I was reading about this in The Economist this week).

I wouldn't choose to get half as much Baht as 12 years ago, but since I have to go somewhere on holiday, Thailand needs to be compared with the alternatives. For a long stay, Thailand works out way cheaper than any holiday in southern Europe. Looking at low GDP countries, value for money with Thai hotels is way better than in Cambodia or Laos. The availability of boys is better in Thailand. The Philippines has boys with very modest financial expectations and has modest costs for food, coffee etc, but on my first trip there, the higher hotel costs eliminated any advantage.

I disagree about decreasing Thai tourist numbers. Thai stats show them going up every year.
You might question the stats, but my own eyes see ever more tourists & I am inclined to believe the stats.
When Suvarnabhumi opened, as planned they closed Don Muang. This didn't last for long, as they re-opened it for low cost flights. I had the mother of all battles to get my taxi driver to take me to Don Muang just after it reopened, as he thought I should go to Suvarnabhumi. DMK was almost empty. Virtually no aircraft and no passengers, with a handful of flights.
Now Suvarnabhumi is noticeably way more crowded than 10 years ago. A new terminal extension is under construction. DMK has flights leaving at an ever increasing frequency and is in some areas packed.
There are also international flights from China, Russia & KL going to Utapao, which again, with my own eyes, looked much more busy than 10 years ago.
Pattaya has constant construction of hotels and apartments. For instance, look at what's gone up just downhill from Sansuk. Seems popular with Russian customers.

If tourist numbers have gone down, which I doubt, they would at worst be a tad below 2018 levels and ahead of 2017 levels. A slight pull back in numbers after growing aggressively for many years would be no disaster.
However, I suspect reported AND real 2019 tourist numbers will be at or above 2018 levels. The percentage of these tourists in gay bars will be below that of 10 years ago.

[Dodger]

My daughter and son-in-law just departed Thailand after enjoying their first visit here. They loved the beach, serenity, restaurants, and surroundings of Bang Saray, as well as some of the other beaches and islands we visited down the southern shoreline. They said that next time they will be bringing their children along. We visited Pattaya one night to take in dinner, a show, and a stroll down Walking Street. They both commented that Pattaya was a fabulous party place for singles and couples without children, but definitely not a place they would bring the family for a vacation. In their opinions, the beaches were too polluted, the traffic was too bad, and there are more bars than Carter has liver pills. Pattaya, in their opinion, is definitely not a place for a family vacation.

The illusion (fake numbers) that TOT is projecting have to be seriously skewed. There are clearly plenty of tourists in Pattaya, mostly party-goers and those interested in exotic fun, and the rest are penny-pinching Chinese. Gay tourism is in a steady decline for the obvious reasons. As far as Thailand's attempts at transitioning from sex tourism to a family oriented vacation dream, has not worked, nor will it. In order for that to work, they would have to get a new ocean, and uproot the thousands of beer bars, host bars, gogo bars, exotic massage parlors, karaoke bars, disco's and illegal gambling shacks, etc., with playgrounds and dairy Queen ice cream stands, which of course will never happen.

My daughter and son-in-law probably spent about $200 a day, which mostly went towards gifts, handcrafts, etc., that you don't see at shops in the U.S. We visited the Train Market in Bangkok where my daughter wanted to get some more gifts to take home and left with two large bags filled with things she had purchased. The Market was crammed with thousands of Chinese tourists, and honestly, we did not see a single one buying anything other than cheap food at the array of stalls they have there. Thousands of Chinese spending ZERO on retail items, and my daughter probably spent at least $150 that night.

MEAN AVERAGES

FARANG TOURISTS: $200/DAY
CHINESE TOURISTS: $20/DAY
INDIAN/ARAB TOURISTS: $75/DAY
JAPANESE & KOREAN TOURISTS: $125/DAY
EXPATS (RETIREE'S): $75/DAY

[Gaybutton]

my own eyes see ever more tourists & I am inclined to believe the stats.

I go by what I see for myself. I think those of us that live here see things a little differently from those who are only here temporarily on a holiday.

Even in my area on "The Dark Side" I'm seeing tourist decline. For example, on my own soi there is a hotel that caters primarily to the Chinese tour buses. For the past few years there was always at least 3 buses parked there every night. Quite often it would be 5 to 8 buses.

Over the past 3 months, the total number of buses parked there has been zero. Not one. Of course, if there are fewer tour buses and fewer Chinese tourists, no objection from me . . .

[Jun]

Of course I might miss the full 12 months, as I was only in Thailand during the winter.

However, it also depends on where you make your observations.
Gaybutton is counting Chinese tour buses on the dark side.
Dodger is observing purchases in a Train market.

For tourist numbers, I would suggest that my observations at BKK, DMK and UTP airports are casting the net somewhat wider, as pretty much all tourists from outside SEA will arrive by air. I see a vast increase in numbers over 10 years and what I see ties up with the official statistics.

As for average spend, if you see 10 tourists spending $20 per head at a market and someone else sees 2 tourists spending $500 at some luxury shopping mall, the luxury shoppers put the average up from $20 to $100. That's before we count the cost of their hotels and tours.
The wealth is distributed quite unevenly in China and those with the money spend on expensive goods.

I bet if anyone started surveying shopping bags in somewhere like Central Embassy Bangkok, the spend from Chinese shoppers would be much higher.

If someone only looked at the spend within Central Embassy, they would have a very different opinion to someone only looking at tour bus customers.

To get a better subjective "average" it's necessary to take both into account.

[Gaybutton]

Gaybutton is counting Chinese tour buses on the dark side.

Don't underestimate my ability to observe. As for the tour buses on "The Dark Side" I clearly stated that is one example. If you really think that's all I'm taking into consideration, wrong.

Believe what you want, but I live here year round and that puts me and everybody else who lives here year round in a position to see way more than you do - and I know what I'm seeing.

If I spent a couple months per year in London, and then tried to tell people I know all about London and the goings on there, more than people who live there all the time, that wouldn't exactly be valid, would it?