New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

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Undaunted
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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Undaunted » Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:23 am

Dodger wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:34 am
Undaunted wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 7:56 pm
All this just one more reason for expats to consider other places beyond Thailand.
Would it make more sense for expats to consider places beyond Thailand, or to just get health insurance?
The problem is that many people because of age and or existing conditions will be unable to get mandatory health insurance in Thailand.
"In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king"

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Dodger » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:32 am

Undaunted wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:23 am
The problem is that many people because of age and or existing conditions will be unable to get mandatory health insurance in Thailand.
Very valid concern, but the way this thing is unfolding, those who are already retired here won't be forced to have health insurance. People over the age of 70 who travel to Thailand on an O-A Visa and want to get an Extension of Stay for Retirement in the future will be required to have (or purchase) health insurance. At least that's the way this thing is headed.

One of the Thai approved insurance companies does insure those over age 70 with preexisting conditions, but the cost of the premium is astronomical. This appears to be a very wise business move on their part. Having said that, I still believe that those over 70 who want to retire in Thailand in the future will get approved regardless of what insurance company they use, as long as it covers the minimum IP and OP in Thailand.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Dodger » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:46 am

Gaybutton wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:23 am
I haven't re-read the requirements, but I would swear I saw something that said people do not have to buy from a Thai insurance company if they can prove they have their own insurance and that insurance covers hospitalization in Thailand.
There have been several new articles making mention of this. Below is a link to just one of them.

https://thethaiger.com/thai-life/mandat ... foreigners

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by 2lz2p » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:53 am

Dodger wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 8:29 am
The way Immigration interprets this
What was said months ago before the new rules were issued by Immigration HQ do not hold much meaning. Immigration changes the rules all the time and, of course, different Offices have different interpretations. Also, when rules are first announced, before issuance, or are newly issued, you may get several different interpretations from Immigration Offices and even Officers within the same Office.

The Chief of Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration is reported to have said months ago when the rules changed in January 2019 for those that use the monthly income method and can no longer get an Embassy certification letter will not be able to use the "combo" method (combination of monthly income and bank deposit => 800k). BUT, in the past month, I have had Expats tell me they did use that method and had their extensions approved at Pattaya Immigration without having to have an Embassy certification.

Likewise, the rules regarding Health insurance were issued in October 2019 by Immigration HQ to be effective October 31, 2019. This sign was posted this week at Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration and the person who sent it to me was explicitly told at Desk 8 (Retirement desk) after they asked him to show them his passport (showed that all his extensions were based on original entry with a Non-OA Visa). He was then told "yes" you will be required to have evidence of health insurance with the minimum coverage requirements and it must be from one of the companies listed on the TGIA website - which is consistent with the Immigration HQ rule change issued in October 2019.

Before stating categorically that that is not the case, I would suggest you re-approach the Colonel (Chief) at Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration and see if that is still his statement - if yes, then ask him why his staff are saying something different and posting a sign at their desk (#8, retirement) stating otherwise. I think you will find that his story has now changed.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Gaybutton » Wed Nov 06, 2019 12:48 pm

2lz2p wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:53 am
I would suggest you re-approach the Colonel (Chief) at Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration and see if that is still his statement
Does that matter? The only thing that matters is what you will be told by the immigration officer at the moment you apply for the extension. Even if it directly contradicts what the Colonel might have said, does anyone really think he will support the farang over his own officer?

In my opinion, the only way to be certain of getting the extension is to strictly comply with the rules, whether fair, unfair, or based on someone else's interpretation.

Again, I urge people applying for the extension to do so as far in advance of the expiration date as possible, to make sure you have enough time to do whatever the immigration officer tells you to do. Arguing with the officer about it will only make things worse.

The way it works - either comply with what the immigration officer wants or you don't get the extension.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Bob » Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:42 pm

GB: Please delete my post earlier today. Turns out the guy was either mistaken (kinda hard to believe as he's been here a while) or lied about having come in on an O-A visa....so his report turns out to be baloney.

In other words, we still have no idea if CM Immigration is or isn't going to require the long-stay health insurance for extensions for people who came in on O-A visas years ago.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Gaybutton » Wed Nov 06, 2019 2:12 pm

Bob wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:42 pm
GB: Please delete my post earlier today.
Ok, the post is now deleted.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Dodger » Wed Nov 06, 2019 3:41 pm

2lz2p wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:53 am
I would suggest you re-approach the Colonel (Chief) at Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration and see if that is still his statement - if yes, then ask him why his staff are saying something different and posting a sign at their desk (#8, retirement) stating otherwise. I think you will find that his story has now changed.
THE BLIND LEADING THE BLIND
You may be absolutely correct Then again, there's always the chance that the immigration officer your friends spoke with could be misinterpreting this thing as well. I mean, let's face it, there are no two news articles on the subject that say the same thing. There are no two immigration offices saying the same thing. There are no two officers (clerks) saying the same thing. Right now we're following blind people.

This reminds me of listening to my overly-enthusiastic Italian relatives arguing about who's going to win the World Series - the Chicago White Sox or New York Yankees, before the playoffs even started. Neither team even made it to the World Series that year, but not one of them would ever admit to being wrong. Go figure!

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by 2lz2p » Wed Nov 06, 2019 5:45 pm

Gaybutton wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:23 am
I haven't re-read the requirements, but I would swear I saw something that said people do not have to buy from a Thai insurance company if they can prove they have their own insurance and that insurance covers hospitalization in Thailand.
When the Ministry of Public Health official(s) initially announced that the Thai Cabinet had approved their proposal to require health insurance for the Category O-A Visa, they did mention that health insurance bought from overseas could be used and consideration given to self insurance. But, that did not come about.

https://thethaiger.com/thai-life/mandat ... foreigners
The article linked above was published in May 2019 before the "details" were settled on between Public Health, Foreign Affairs, and Immigration.

When the rules came out, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs apparently agreed to accept foreign insurance policies when applying for the O-A Visa at a Thai Embassy/Consulate. But, Immigration's rules for granting an extension of the permission to stay do not have such a provision. Instead, they state the policy must be from those insurance companies on the Thailand General Insurance Association (TGIA) website, which are all Thai companies. The final requirements of both Foreign Affairs and Immigration do not have any provisions for self insurance.

Here is what now appears on the Thai Embassy in Washington DC on requirements for the O-A Visa: https://thaiembdc.org/consular-services ... tegory-oa/ If you click on the link for the Foreign Insurance Certificate Form (item 8.2), you will see the form requires the foreign insurance company to certify the policy meets the Cabinet's resolution re health insurance (but doesn't state what the resolution required) and requires the signature of two "directors" rather than "officers" -- that and not knowing what the Thai Cabinet resolution says, may make getting such a certificate problematic.

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Re: New Health Insurance Requirements Announced O-A

Post by Gaybutton » Wed Nov 06, 2019 6:10 pm

2lz2p wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 5:45 pm
they state the policy must be from those insurance companies on the Thailand General Insurance Association (TGIA) website, which are all Thai companies. The final requirements of both Foreign Affairs and Immigration do not have any provisions for self insurance.
Seems to me they are trying to create what is tantamount to a monopoly. O-A visa holders who want extensions will be forced to buy TGIA insurance, pay whatever prices they want to charge, cannot use any other insurance companies, and no provision for self-insuring.

Meanwhile, not one word from any of the embassies about the unfairness of this. I'm disappointed in the embassies' apparent refusal to take any kind of stand whatsoever regarding Thailand's immigration policies.

Trump, how about a quid pro quo about this . . . ?

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