UFOs - The Disclosure Project:Sirius

[RichLB]

I know, we've discussed this before and I seem to be the only one convinced UFOs, alien visitations, and cover ups are real. I'd like to recommend you get a copy of Sirius. It's available for purchase or you can download it from torrents. Dr. Steven Greer presents a compelling case with substantial authentication that should, at least, open any minds which are not welded shut and convince those flexible enough to entertain the unimaginable. It's the best documentary on the subject I've ever seen. I'd love to discuss it here.
And, not as unique as the other documentary, but still pretty convincing is the following - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1WWRJinIU4. Lots of testimonials from reliable witnesses and enough data to make the most die hard naysayer bite his tongue.

[Bob]

(Said to the score of the Twilight Zone playing in the background): The best evidence of the existence of intelligent alien life forms is that they've had the good sense to stay the hell away from this wacky planet!

[RichLB]

(Said to the score of the Twilight Zone playing in the background): The best evidence of the existence of intelligent alien life forms is that they've had the good sense to stay the hell away from this wacky planet!

Grin, after watching these two documentaries, you might not be so sure of that.

[Bob]

A movie brought to you by The Daily Saucer which panders to those who want to believe or can't help themselves. Sorry, Rich, I could only handle 20 minutes of it. If you believe in ET and he/she/its been here, there nothing anybody can say that could convince you otherwise. I, on the other hand, don't believe anything which isn't generally accepted scientific fact unless I've seen the proof for myself. I do presume we both agree that the appearance or visitation of ET's to planet earth is not a generally accepted scientific fact.

[RichLB]

Actually, (I forget the actual number) the majority of people believe UFOs are real. I accept there are many people who resist accepting facts which contradict traditional beliefs. Of course, if those people prevailed we'd still believe the universe revolved around the earth, the world was flat, nothing heavier than air could fly, etc. The argument that it couldn't be true because one has never seen one, makes me wonder why they believe in atoms, black holes, etc. More confounding, to me, is the discounting of real data - the Phoenix lights which were witnessed by tens of thousands over a 7 month period, the Mexico lights, radar confirmation of observed phenomena, military confirmation (Los Angeles, Roswell, that military base in England, etc.), reports of respected and trained individuals including President Carter and the ex-governor of Arizona, and so on. I am actually bewildered that there are still folks who cling to the misinformation they have been fed. By the way, Sirius was a Bayview Films production, not the source you cited.

[Gaybutton]

More confounding, to me, is the discounting of real data

I don't discount the real data. I don't doubt that people have seen things they can't explain. What I discount is what I consider to be crackpot interpretations of what they saw. To me, it is convoluted logic to assume that because nobody, not even scientists, can explain what people saw, then it must be aliens. I managed to force myself to sit through 'Sirius.' Nothing about it convinced me that aliens have been here. The fact that I am not convinced, as you are, does not mean my "mind is welded shut." I'd like nothing better than to finally have proof - real proof - that life does exist elsewhere and if it's intelligent life, better still. But films such as 'Sirius' do not constitute proof. They only constitute interpretation.

I used to think if aliens had really come here, then why didn't they introduce themselves? I no longer think that. Now I think if aliens really had the intelligence and technology to be able to travel here from wherever they came from, and from among the billions and billions of places to look they somehow managed to find us, then as soon as they saw what we have to offer - North Korea, polluted environment, wars, bombings, slavery, torture, starvation, air unfit to breathe, food unfit to eat, water unfit to drink, using up all our energy resources and ruining the planet in the process, and all the rest of the fabulous things to be found here, they also would have had the intelligence to turn around and go back home - as fast as their flying saucers could carry them - and report that's one planet to scratch off the list.

I'll believe in alien visitations as soon as one of their ships lands, beings emerge, and it's all covered live on CNN.

My favorite movie involving aliens was "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home." Remember that one? That was the one where they have to travel back in time to bring a pair of whales to the future because an alien craft is trying to communicate with the whales without realizing they had been hunted to extinction, and in the process the aliens are destroying humanity. All human attempts to communicate with the aliens are fruitless and humans are being completely ignored. Spock says something to the effect of "Only human arrogance would cause the assumption that they necessarily came here to communicate with people." Maybe if aliens really ever did come here, they weren't even interested in contact with humans at all.

By the way, how come when aliens resemble humans, they all wear clothes, but if they are more like creatures such as "E.T." or "War of the Worlds," they all go naked?

[xiandarkthorne]

Now I think if aliens really had the intelligence and technology to be able to travel here from wherever they came from, and from among the billions and billions of places to look they somehow managed to find us, then as soon as they saw what we have to offer - North Korea, polluted environment, wars, bombings, slavery, torture, starvation, air unfit to breathe, food unfit to eat, water unfit to drink, using up all our energy resources and ruining the planet in the process, and all the rest of the fabulous things to be found here, they also would have had the intelligence to turn around and go back home - as fast as their flying saucers could carry them - and report that's one planet to scratch off the list.

And here I was thinking that interplanetary aliens came here to look at us the same way we gawk at animals in the zoo...

By the way, how come when aliens resemble humans, they all wear clothes, but if they are more like creatures such as "E.T." or "War of the Worlds," they all go naked?

Because aliens think our plumbing's ugly?

[RichLB]

I'd like nothing better than to finally have proof - real proof - that life does exist elsewhere and if it's intelligent life, better still. But films such as 'Sirius' do not constitute proof. They only constitute interpretation.

I'm curious what would constitute real proof to you. Apparently observation by tens of thousands of people (trained and untrained), radar confirmation, military jets scambling to intercept, government efforts to deceive the population (Roswell, Project Blue Book, threats of harm to those who speak out, technological spikes unsupported by background efforts, etc.) are not persuasive to the naysayers. These people are content to just chuckle or shake their head at those who take these factors into account. Sirius provides an explanation why the coverup and misinformation could be an implemented program. The movie also presents a theory on how aliens may have solved the faster than light barrier (although it did go a bit over my head). I agree alien visitation is but one explanation for the phenomena, but I'm not aware of an alternative one. Surely no one buys the weather balloon, atmospheric disturbance, and pranksters explanations for the mountain of evidence believers present. To be dissuaded from accepting the Sirius evidence, I would need some explanation for the phenomena - including why so many respected citizens (ex-presidents, decorated military officers, universities such as Stanford, pilots both military and civilian, and so one) are willing to open themselves up to public ridicule for no material gain.

[Gaybutton]

I'm curious what would constitute real proof to you.

When the news channels start giving it 24/7 coverage, which you know they will, when there can be no possible doubt, that's when I'll accept it as proof. I don't buy the idea about government efforts to cover it up. All the reasons they give as to why the government would cover it up comes across to me just like an Oliver Stone interpretation of history. I find all the reasons they say the government covers it up as ridiculous. I believe if the government - any government from any country - that actually has had a space ship land, the last thing they would do is cover it up. Crackpot interpretation.

You say "I agree alien visitation is but one explanation for the phenomena, but I'm not aware of an alternative one." That's exactly my point. The fact that nobody can explain it doesn't mean there isn't an explanation. And the last thing on my list of explanations would be aliens. Crackpot explanation.

It's always the same thing - unexplained lights in the sky. Wreckage of a crashed alien ship. Are you seriously trying to convince me that aliens have technology so advanced that they have the capability of coming here, and once they get here then whoops-Crash! And it's always an alien dead body. Where's the ambassador from the planet Picklelilly?

[Bob]

Actually, (I forget the actual number) the majority of people believe UFOs are real.

So? Only reflects to me how sad our educational system has become. A majority of the voters in Alaska voted for Sarah Palin too.

You can't have it both ways. You mention that we earthlings believed the earth was flat once and that we later found out that was untrue. Well, I guess you're trying to expose two notions - that what the majority believes might be nonsense and we ought to let true science explain reality. As I mentioned before (and invite you to disagree if in fact you do), the presence or past visitation of ET's to the planet earth is not accepted as scientific fact by any significant percentage of scientists anywhere.