Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

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#31 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby firecat69 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 9:46 pm

One of the problems is the Media . Rather then hi light the fact that millions of undocumented workers are in the USA making Dopes like Trump richer , they follow the bouncing ball and citizens who are busy trying to make a living actually believe the undocumented workers are taking their jobs.

First of all we are at virtual full employment. Those that are unemployed for the most part don't have the proper skills and don't want the jobs the undocumented workers are doing.

Do you think the average person and especially Trump voters realize if the USA could wave a magic wand and make all undocumented workers and their spouses and children disappear , that the US Economy would collapse. Well it certainly would . Country Clubs would all fail, restaurants would fail , all farmers would fail , home builders would fail, Hotels would fail and a Great Depression would likely happen.

So yes I am pissed off at the Pizza man being picked up not because they did not have the right to pick him up but because he was unfortunate to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. And there are too many people who say he got what he deserved instead of looking at the bigger picture and realizing millions making our economy hum are the same undocumented workers that so far have lucked out.

This is how supposedly Greatest Democracy in the world is supposed to act. I think not!

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#32 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby Gaybutton » Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:15 pm

firecat69 wrote:too many people who say he got what he deserved instead of looking at the bigger picture

I'm one of them. It is not instead of looking at the bigger picture. It is along with looking at the big picture. I can still chew gum and walk.

I'm not blind. I know what would happen if all the undocumented workers had to leave. I don't want that to happen any more than you do. That is why the immigration laws need to change, so that people like this unfortunate man won't have to be unfortunate.

But until the laws change, whether they are necessary to the economy or not, these people have no right to be in the USA. When they are caught, they have to face the consequences of the risk they took.

Saying the economy would collapse without them, in my opinion, is no different from the South trying to justify slavery by saying their economy would collapse without them.

If you want to be outraged by discrimination of foreign nationals, see the latest American Experience or read about the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 - and it wasn't repealed until nearly 1944.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Exclusion_Act

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#33 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby firecat69 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 11:19 pm

The whole point is if you don't look at the bigger picture then it is easy to say the Pizza Man got what he deserved. Yes he was unlucky and he was picked up , but for me he did not get what he deserved . When a Law is not used in the same way then that Law should be repealed . I don't fault the military individuals for doing their job, I fault the entire US Government for not applying the Law equally. Does anyone think that the Government does not know where millions of undocumented workers are. If they do they are either ignorant or live in some state where there are no undocumented workers. Not sure which state that would be, maybe Vermont but I doubt it.

That is how for years Gays could not marry , serve in the Military etc. If a Law cannot be used fairly across the entire population, then that Law is bad and any fruits of that Law are illegitimate .

So if people don't speak out when someone has the bad luck to be caught up by a Law then please tell me how anything will change?

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#34 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby Gaybutton » Mon Jun 11, 2018 12:39 am

firecat69 wrote:So if people don't speak out when someone has the bad luck to be caught up by a Law then please tell me how anything will change?

Of course people should speak out for what they believe is right. I don't disagree with or dispute that. That's where the big picture comes in.

But right now, in this case, the smaller picture is also being dealt with. I don't see how, in his case, whether he got what he deserved is even going to be relevant to the outcome. From the moment his status became illegal and he chose not to leave, he placed himself at risk. He gambled that he would be able to get away with living in the USA as an illegal alien. He gambled and lost.

I also don't see how it can be disputed that he has been living illegally in the USA. The fact that he was caught means he is likely to be deported. If the sequence of events affected only him there wouldn't be much to debate about. He is clearly illegal. As I see it, the problem is he has a wife and children. If he is deported or has to remain in custody for an extended period of time, that will hurt his family. His children are certainly innocent, but they will become victims.

He was ordered to leave 8 years ago. He didn't. Look at the photo of his children. Do either of them look as if they are 8 years old, or older? Not to me, they don't. That means he had children after being ordered to leave. It's one thing to risk himself, but it's quite another to knowingly place his own children at risk. That's exactly what he did. My sympathies go with his family, but not with him. His own actions, actions he chose himself, placed his family in this position and that is why I have no sympathy for him.

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#35 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby firecat69 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:56 am

I give up. We are never going to agree.Like it or not nothing will ever change unless some people defend the individuals who were unlucky, while millions do not suffer because many people don't want it to change.

People need to be outraged by the uneven treatment if anything is going to change! Although not a fan of Ronald Reagan for personal reasons, we need a Reagan to stop this uneven treatment of undocumented workers.

Which of course now means we need Democrats in charge because there are definitely no Ronald Reagans in the Republican Party!

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#36 Re: Pizza delivery man faces deportation - What's your opinion?

Postby Gaybutton » Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:22 am

firecat69 wrote:We are never going to agree.

That's the dilemma. I think we both have valid points and they represent what many more than just us are thinking. We have a Congress that won't even do anything about gun control, much less give a damn about doing anything to change immigration policy. If anything, considering this insane Congress we're currently stuck with, if they actually do anything they'll probably only make the problems worse than they are already.

News about this story will fade away and be forgotten, just like everything else. Meanwhile, if we address this same issue a year from now, I'll be shocked if anything at all has changed.

One last question - one that has not appeared in the news - Did whoever ordered that pizza ever get it . . . ?


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