Trump News Conference

Alex
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Re: Trump News Conference

Post by Alex »

RichLB wrote:If those voters were lied to and manipulated, does anyone really believe Trump was "honestly" the people's choice.
That's a dangerous argument, because each and every politician lies (it's what they do for a living). So you could make the case "if only the electorate had known" way too often.

In your opinion, what exactly should happen and who should be the judge? If you give the electorate a way to reconsider their choice and to recall their candidate before their term ends (or in this extreme case, before it has even started), this would lead to anarchy.

In a democracy, this is quite simple really: Next chance for the electorate to make up their collective mind in four years! In the US in particular, there's also the midterm elections after just two years that can be used to send a message and curb the president's effective powers - if and when that's what the people want to do.

Questioning the legitimacy of Trump at this point is just silly. It is also extremely dangerous, and keep in mind how many of Hillary's fanboys kept fear mongering that Trump's supporters might not accept her win...
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Gaybutton
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Re: Trump News Conference

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Alex wrote:In your opinion, what exactly should happen and who should be the judge?
In my opinion, at this point anything that could legally prevent Trump from being sworn in would have to be a Supreme Court decision.

The only thing I could see happening is if Trump gets arrested for a felony and is denied bail. Obviously that is not going to happen. Even if it could have happened, it would have happened by now.

Who knows? Maybe a president can be sworn in while in jail. Actually, given such a bizarre scenario, I don't know of anything legal that could prevent it. He is the subject of numerous accusations, but he has not been tried and convicted of anything. I know of nothing in the law that could prevent a President Elect from being sworn in based only on an accusation.

Meanwhile, like it or not, Donald Trump will be sworn in as the next President of the United States. Like it or not, he won the election. I won't say he won it "fair and square," but he did win. Like it or not, he beat all the other Republican candidates in the primaries and he won the electoral vote.

I just hope his presidency won't be, to use one of his own favorite words, a "disaster."
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Re: Trump News Conference

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Alex wrote:That's a dangerous argument, because each and every politician lies (it's what they do for a living).
What you say is true, but there is a case to be made for false equivalency. Lies about future plans are common, but lies about treasonous behavior are far more serious. While one user here seems to think the issue stems from sour grapes from Hillary supporters, I think it is far more serious. Trump is accused of compromising US foreign policy and being vulnerable to blackmail from Russia. The intelligence community of the US takes these charges seriously as does British intelligence. If the controversy was of insignificant impact to national security or if it merely centered on Trump's sexual morality, one could possibly suggest we "give him a chance" and "wait and see". But, his behavior is NOT insignificant. While we may not be able to stop him being sworn in, we can refuse to support him and encourage Congress to keep a sharp eye on the man to impeach him if his presidential behavior mirrors his actions to date.
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Undaunted
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Re: Trump News Conference

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RichLB wrote: While we may not be able to stop him being sworn in, we can refuse to support him and encourage Congress to keep a sharp eye on the man to impeach him if his presidential behavior mirrors his actions to date.
Many things that he has said are in direct opposition to the Republican leadership and I believe in office many of his actions will also be in opposition to the republican leadership. When they have had enough of him they will actively look for a reason to impeach him. Good, bad, or indifferent Trump is his own man and the Republicans will view him as a renegade it is just a matter of time.
"In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king"
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Re: Trump News Conference

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Undaunted wrote:When they have had enough of him they will actively look for a reason to impeach him.
And then there would be President Pence. Six of one, half a dozen of the other, in my opinion - unless of course there is an expectation that Pence would end up impeached too.

And if that actually happens, then there would be President Paul Ryan. Oh, goodie goodie . . .

At the moment Trump and Ryan are talking about the "better" plan to replace Obamacare. Of course, no specifics yet. But if their plan will include expats, rather than forcing expats to have to be on US soil to take advantage of Medicare, Obamacare, or anything else, then at least for me my opinion of the Republicans would go up a few notches.

Travelerjim, next time you talk to Trump, remind him of that, willya? We expats paid into it all our lives too.
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Re: Trump News Conference

Post by Oliver »

Pence would be worse in that he'd become president with a degree of goodwill and support simply because he is not so obviously a buffoon like Trump.
In fact, his evangelical fundamentalism is probably more of a threat in that it is ideological, rather- as in Trump's case- the whining of a spoilt brat.
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Re: Trump News Conference

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RichLB wrote:Trump is accused of compromising US foreign policy and being vulnerable to blackmail from Russia. The intelligence community of the US takes these charges seriously as does British intelligence.
Okay, he is accused, I know that. Have you seen any credible proof for these serious accusations? I haven't.

While the information just hit the public recently, it has been circulating for months. I would assume that, if any crime had been committed, Obama's Attorney General would have been all over it, ensuring that he gets indicted on time. That hasn't happened, so I tend to assume it's all bollocks.
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Re: Trump News Conference

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Alex wrote: Okay, he is accused, I know that. Have you seen any credible proof for these serious accusations? I haven't.
I'm glad you included the word "credible" in you comment. 17 intelligence agencies of the US, MI-6 in Britain, and even a few congressional leaders are taking these accusations seriously. And then we can add Trump's stated intention to violate the emoluments clause of the US Constitution. In addition, we have now learned that Flynn (Trump's National Security Advisor) was on the phone to Russia mollifying them on the very day Obama was imposing new sanctions. What more evidence do you need to not be alarmed that this man will soon assume the Presidency of the US?
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Re: Trump News Conference

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RichLB wrote:And then we can add Trump's stated intention to violate the emoluments clause of the US Constitution.
My interpretation of that boils down to accepting bribes and/or other forms of compensation in return for favoritism. That would be an impeachable offense. But he would have to actually do that and get caught before there could even be any talk about impeachment on that basis.

I'm not among those who hope to see some miracle prevent him from taking office or wind up impeached. That's because I don't like what I see regarding who would take office if Trump winds up being legally removed.

Also the impeachment process doesn't happen overnight. Look at Nixon. The Watergate hearings lasted for months before it became obvious that Nixon would be impeached. If Nixon had decided to stand trial, that would also probably have taken months and the country would have been gridlocked to a standstill throughout the whole damned thing. If Trump gets impeached at some point and opts to stand trial, it won't be good, especially after millions of dollars are spent and it lasts for months, perhaps even years. And if in the end he is convicted and removed from office, we'll then be stuck with Pence. Not exactly my idea of a desirable outcome.

I still think Trump will take office and will go through his 4 years without having to face impeachment. And if he runs again for the 2020 election, we might have him for 8 years.

My hope is Congress will prevent some of Trump's more extreme policies from ever happening. Just because the Republicans have the majority, that doesn't mean they're going to be a rubber stamp for Trump.
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Undaunted
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Re: Trump News Conference

Post by Undaunted »

Gaybutton wrote: My hope is Congress will prevent some of Trump's more extreme policies from ever happening. Just because the Republicans have the majority, that doesn't mean they're going to be a rubber stamp for Trump.
This is where the fun will begin, I have always thought of him as an independent rather than a mainstream Republican, actually at a time he was a registered Democrat. Be that as it may, the Republican congress is in for many surprises.

On another note I think Congressman John Lewis and other Democrats that intend on boycotting the inauguration should not. As official representatives they should respect the office of the president, if not the man.
"In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king"
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