English

[lvdkeyes]

I realize this is going to start a firestorm, but why can't posters use, at least, a semblance of correct grammar and spelling when posting? Is it stupidity or sheer laziness? I am not talking about people who use English as a second language; I mean native English speakers, Americans, Brits, Aussies, Canadians and New Zealanders.

[Bob]

Yes, it's amazing ("stupifying" might be a more appropriate word) how a few Brits and Americans write on the various message boards. I presume (perhaps incorrectly) that all denizens of the boards have at least graduated from high school; yet, if that's the case, how the principals of those schools weren't fired for granting them a diploma is beyond me.

Besides technical mistakes of grammar, run-on sentences that end up making no sense, and spelling errors, sometimes the composition is so terribly constructed that it makes me wonder if there isn't something more serious going on other than a lack of learning. Perhaps age (combined with some alzenheimers-type affliction) also increases the problem for some of us. I find myself making mistakes (such as switching "their" for "they're") that I never made before and I'm actually rather embarrassed when/if I finally notice them (hell, I know better - or at least I thought I did).

What's sad sometimes is that a given poster seems to have the kernel of something important or witty to say but, due to the language mangling, he ends up sounding like Jethro DeBodine. And, with little better grammar, he actually might have conveyed an intelligible thought! Go figure.

[fountainhall]

. . . makes me wonder if there isn't something more serious going on other than a lack of learning . . .

We've seen examples of this in posters who have turned out to be trolls and thereafter banned. And I've little doubt one or two others do it deliberately.

[Gaybutton]

It is truly unfortunate that some fail to take much care or pride in what they sign their name to, even if it's just a screen name on a message board. They could write the most profound statements, but when their posts are filled with spelling, grammar, punctuation, and lord-know-what-else mistakes, now any impact or credibility of the post and the person who posted is diminished. In other words, the person who posted is very likely to come across as just plain dumb.

This board is set so that people have two hours to edit their post after they submit it. I believe most people who make these kinds of mistakes are well aware they're not the world's greatest spellers and would have trouble passing themselves off as English majors. I would think someone who cares about his post would, if nothing else, at least run his post through a word processor first, do the spelling and grammar check, and then copy and paste the result into his post. But let me delete one of their posts and they're the first ones to start screaming. I don't worry very much about deleting someone's post when it is obvious it was asking too much for him to bother checking for errors in the first place. Often, when I receive "Why did you delete my post?" PMs, I feel like responding with "You didn't give a damn about your post. Why should I?"

I really don't see much of an excuse for adults who take the time to write posts to submit them filled with mistakes no self-respecting twelve year old would submit in a homework assignment. I don't know why so many people fail to at least proofread before hitting the 'submit' icon or go back and correct the mistakes if they spot them after submitting.

I would have thought it to be very embarrassing to read an ad an 18 year old Thai boy placed on Gay Romeo and then realize his spelling, grammar, and ability to at least be coherent with his English was far better than my own.

[Jun]

I must confess it is easy to occasionally write "their" when I know perfectly well "there" should be used, or other such mistakes. However, some people seem to get this wrong every time!

Certain members make significant mistakes with almost every post & they may not even bother with punctuation.

Also, as GB suggests: If someone takes no care whatsoever with their post, then why should the moderator take the trouble to write a PM when deleting it?

Perhaps it needs a rule along the lines of "Badly written posts may be deleted at the moderators discretion". Actually, if I remember correctly, at least one member has been booted off this board for that already. One or two others seem to be near the limits.

Of course, exceptions should be made for obvious cases of people writing English as a second language.

[I know this post will be proof read for mistakes & undoubtedly there will be some imperfections. However, that's completely different from taking no care whatsoever]

[lvdkeyes]

Yes, my point was not directed at occasional errors or those who use English as a second language.

[Gaybutton]

if I remember correctly, at least one member has been booted off this board for that already.

If someone was booted off the board, I assure you that alone would not have been the reason. If I started booting people for that kind of a reason, a very significant portion of the membership would find themselves looking for someplace else to post.

[RichLB]

I've got to confess I'm also appalled at the level of writing skills evident not only on the Message Boards, but in general. But, let's face it, most of us who post are writing off the cuff as the spirit moves us. I'm guessing we have a reaction and just want it posted while the flame is hot. I know when I post something, I'm not trying to compose something for posterity and don't really feel like "cleaning it up" after posting. I suppose it would be more polite if I did so, but let's not be so constipated with our adherence to grammar and spelling that we discourage people from posting.

[Gaybutton]

but let's not be so constipated with our adherence to grammar and spelling that we discourage people from posting.

Why not? I don't look at it that way. I see no valid reason why people can't clean up what they're going to post. If they're posting in the heat of the moment, then let them post in the heat of two moments. Also, plenty of posts are submitted that are not done in the heat of anything. If someone is taking the time to write something to post, they're writing it for others to read, aren't they? Isn't that worth taking an extra moment to proofread and correct? A typo here and there is one thing, but many of these posts are ridiculous. Are you seriously trying to say it takes great effort and more than a quarter of a second to at least hold down the shift key to start a sentence with a capital letter? Is it too much to ask that people actually end a sentence with a period? Sorry, but I don't buy that at all.

Many of us have a good laugh when we see incorrect English spelling on menus and signs in Thailand. Maybe some of these people might stop laughing when they realize those mistakes still constitute far better English than posts coming from native English speakers.

The whole point of correct spelling, punctuation, and grammar is to make writing readable and intelligible. You see the same posts I see. You know as well as I do that far too many are incoherent, indecipherable, and accomplish little more other than to be highly annoying to people trying to translate English into English. I often think some of these people must have been asleep in the back of the classroom the day English was taught in school. I don't see any justification for a new version of a Rosetta Stone to be necessary in order to easily read posts that should have been correctly written in the first place. If people truly are going to be discouraged from posting because they are expected to write correctly, then personally I'm perfectly willing to try to survive the loss.

[Jun]

if I remember correctly, at least one member has been booted off this board for that already.

If someone was booted off the board, I assure you that alone would not have been the reason.

Good point. Actually I probably don't remember correctly. Maybe he was kicked out due to a rather rude response, after you requested he wrote proper sentences. I still rely on the IGNORE function to avoid his incomprehensible posts on another one of the other good Thai forums.

Making no effort whatsoever is a consequence of there being no reasonable mechanism to discourage such behaviour.