Despots of Communist China

Anything and everything about gay life anywhere in the world, especially Asia, other than Thailand.
firecat69
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#11 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby firecat69 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:40 am

It is a period of history I am not completely familiar with and the only mention of FDR was a phone call made to the President asking for help prior to Dunkirk. In the movie he refused and suggested he might be able to bring some planes near the Canadian Border and Churchill would have to find a way to drag them across.

So my comment was not meant to be critical of FDR but only to mention that the only mention of him in this particular movie was not flattering.

That said I just watched the movie for the 2nd time in my home instead of the theater . Maybe liked it even more if possible.Gary Oldman is a slam dunk for the Best Actor!

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#12 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby Jun » Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:47 pm

My understanding was that US public opinion was against involvement in the war. That I can completely understand, as whilst the Nazis could have eventually threatened the US, the short term justification for sending young men to fight a European war would not be attractive.

FDR had come around to being in favour of involvement before Japan conveniently forced the issue. Or that's how documentaries present the issue.

However, in 2018, we should learn a few lessons from that:

Currently US generously props up NATO, whilst European countries have inadequate investment in defence. Relying on the US to come to our aid is an unreliable strategy. Who knows what Trump or his successor might do ? Bernie Sanders was against the US defending other countries. In fact, why should we expect US support, if not prepared to invest adequately in our own defence ?
I'm very grateful for US support in NATO, but we should understand the risks of being dependent on that in a changing political environment.

The UK has a higher GDP than Russia. Germany has a higher GDP than Russia. Combined, we have a larger population. Yet, if we fought a conventional war, without US support, Europe would be rapidly defeated. Considering our resources, any 2 large European countries should be capable of defending themselves against Russia. But we are not.

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#13 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby firecat69 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:47 pm

The one thing we can be sure of is that any country that falls into dictatorship or its equivalent even with lipstick on a pig is a danger to the world.

Unfortunately more countries are going down that path . Turkey certainly has and of course Russia . Now the worry the world should have is that Communist China is moving toward that path. One man with all the power and no need to be elected . That is the definition of a dictator and with China being the 1st or 2nd biggest economy in the world , the world would be foolish not to worry about their intentions.

We have already seen them build their ridiculous islands and claim their sovereignty of surrounding waters . We know they have no problems stealing intellectual properties . It is foolish to think they will use their economic power for the good of the world.

The USA needs to get rid of Trump and elect a Congress that once again will stand up for those unable to stand up for themselves .

The old saying that the USA always does the right thing but only after trying all the bad alternatives first has never been truer.

One thing for sure is that nobody loves Trump more than Communist China. He stupidly falls into all the traps they set for him and can always just give him a parade.

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#14 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby firecat69 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:21 pm

And so it continues! Xi the Dictator throwing his adversaries in jail, confiscating their money. Xi will have to stop building empty buildings and replace with them jails or maybe ?

What would anyone else expect from Communists who have no regard for individual rights . Trump the idiot says nothing because he would prefer to have the Government of Xi and roll over all his critics and throw them in Jail just as Xi continues to do.

No one in the world to stand up to China because the worlds greatest democracy is under assault from Trump and his minions. The world keeps moving towards a very dangerous place.

https://www.theatlantic.com/internation ... re/389787/

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#15 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby fountainhall » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:14 am

I have rarely agreed with firecat69 on the issue if China - and that is unlikely to change since we both hold pretty entrenched positions. But I do agree totally that the elevation of China’s President Xi to a position for life could be dangerous in the longer term. I am less concerned about Xi himself and his policies. I am much more concerned as to what will happen should he be assassinated (and there has been talk of this given the number of high officials he has had jailed for corruption) or who takes over after he finallly retires or dies. Positions for life will eventually throw up someone the world does not want to see.

I consider Deng Xiao Ping to have been one of the handful of great world leaders of the last century. When he was rehabilitated for the second time after Mao’s death his first priority was to modernise the country. In that respect, few can argue that he succeeded far more quickly than could possibly have been imagined. I think I am right in saying no country has developed so quickly in world history.

His second priority was to ensure there would never again be one man who could dominate China’s politics. Although he had been a friend and comrade of Mao for decades, he was witness to Mao’s developing megalomania and powerless to stop his increasingky desperate and ultimately murderous campaigns. In 1982 Deng and those he put in power adopted the system of a maximum of two five-year terms for all officials. To gradually reduce the influence of the hard-line conservatives who continue to wield much influence in China as they do in many countries, he also oversaw the adoption of age limits. And then as his personality was developing into cult status within the country, he mandated that he be cremated and his ashes be buried at sea. For Deng there would be no memorial anywhere for the people to worship, as had been the case with Mao and some other leaders.

I am not sure how Xi has managed to overturn Deng’s reforms. He has unimpeachable family connections to the Long March and has clearly been very successful during his first term both at steering the country and at consolidating his own power. He had also witnessed the growing corruption and ineffectiveness of his predecessor, Hu Jintao, during his 10 year Presidency.

One man who is a world authority on Xi is Kevin Rudd, the former Premier of Australia, and a student of Chinese language and politics for 40 years. He has also known Xi personally for many years and respects him highly. Even he is not sure how the change in the constitution will affect China and the world, and is taking three years out to research and write a new book about it. In a BBC Radio Interview on February 26, he explained that

”we are going to have a very strong Chinese leader leading the country ... through the 2020s when China’s economy will surpass the United States in absolute size and where China’s blueprint for its own power in the region and in the world will continue to be laid out.” In Rudd’s view, it is noteworthy that we “are going to have a non-western, non-English speaking, non-democratic state as the world’s largest economy.

“Anyone who thinks in the collective West that no changes will happen as a result to the current liberal International system, I think is dreaming,” Rudd states.

In a second interview with Fox News on the same day, Rudd said it was interesting that the world’s stock markets did not react negatively to China’s term limits change. He believes that the markets preferred stability for the next 15 or so years - “better the devil we know.”

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#16 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby fountainhall » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:57 am

firecat69 wrote:And so it continues! Xi the Dictator throwing his adversaries in jail . . .

I always find it interesting when firecat69 posts a printed article and then draws conclusions which are either not actually in the article or the opposite of what the article states. The whole point of that New Atlantic article is how successful President Xi has been in comparison to his predecessors in clamping down on corruption, especially amongst high officials. On a first reading, I can see nothing about “throwing his adversaries in jail.”

When he began his stunning economic reforms, Deng Xiao Ping knew well that some corruption would have to be tolerated. What he did not realise was how extensive it would become. Since his death, virtually all the leadership and most officials at local level have been on the take. Even the son of the former President took bribes. Does that make China any different from most emerging societies? Did the fact that South Africa is a democracy prevent its recently deposed President from all manner of major corruption? Absolutely not! Corruption is present in some form in most societies.

Anyone want to mention Thailand? The difference is that in Thailand most of the bigwigs get away with it. On which subject, the heir to the Red Bull fortune remains at large even though he murdered a policeman in 2012 and tried to blame it in a family retainer. That he is gadding about the world a free man Instead of rotting in jail is of course a result of corruption. And what about the USA? Is Trump corrupt? Is the electoral system with its dependence on huge amounts of external money corrupt?

The one thing that Xi has not had thrown at him - and no doubt many would be happy to do so - is corruption. His anti-corruption campaign has been far more successful than earlier ones for a very good reason. In survey after survey and in the media in general, corruption has been highest on the list of grievances in China. Xi’s reforms in this area are winning him a lot of plaudits from the public. How much further he can succeed probably depends on how willing he is to strengthen institutions such as the rule of law and educating the public that the traditional way of doing business through gifts and corruption has to change.

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#17 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby Gaybutton » Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:43 am

fountainhall wrote:Positions for life will eventually throw up someone the world does not want to see.

That's what anyone who wants to make himself a dictator and hold a position for life makes me want to do - throw up.

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#18 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby firecat69 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:47 pm

FH you make me laugh. Certainly you are more educated on the newest Despot in the world of which there are too many as you say.

There is no freedom without a Free Press and the free exchange of ideas. This is something not available in China and you can point to all the other rotten regimes in the world and that won't make 1 change to the fact that China and its rulers survive on the lack of Free Press and their overwhelming Censorship .

Yes they are better at putting some lipstick on the Pig then other disgusting regimes but there is no real freedom in China. Freedom is now what Xi says it is and if you don't like it or pretend so your life will quickly become miserable.
https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom ... 2017/china

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#19 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby fountainhall » Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:35 am

firecat69 - let’s admit it, we make each other laugh! Free Press? Freedom? How can anyone who has never been to a country talk about the “freedoms” or lack thereof and have any real clue of what they are talking? Ah! Of course, they rely on the Free Press elsewhere and the media barons who control it for their information.

Overwhelming censorship? Funny how you can get most of the latest news in China through one means or another. True - you cannot openly criticize President Xi, but the Chinese seem to be as effective in their open criticism of corrupt offialdom as in many free societies, including recent scandals in the UK and the USA. I suppose you believe those bastions of electoral freedom like Japan, Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia enjoy a free press. Well, I have news for you. They don’t! Singapore and Japan control their media extremely effectively - one reason why elections in those countries are a sham.

In early May I will be off to Beijing for at least my 50th visit since 1985. I will meet a lot of long-standing friends, some educated overseas, who are happy with their freedoms - and these include the lack of endless school massacres, the ability to think for themselves and meet and express their opinions, increasingly being able to travel independently and experience other societies almost wherever they wish - and so on. One of those friends, incidentally, produced China’s first openly gay movie with frontal nudity, Lan Yu. This was filmed in 2002 without government sanction and based on a novel published anonymously on the internet. It is widely available in China.

Isn’t it funny? There are freedoms - and there are freedoms!

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#20 Re: Despots of Communist China

Postby Gaybutton » Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:58 am

fountainhall wrote:Isn’t it funny? There are freedoms - and there are freedoms!

"I love America. I love all the freedom we used to have."
- George Carlin


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