ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

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2lz2p
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#21 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby 2lz2p » Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:58 pm

Here is a page from Finder.com that covers transferring funds to Thailand from the US and lists several companies including Transferwise showing the conversion rate and fees for each. Some may require you reside in USA (WordlFirst), which might be a restriction of some of the others. Some also may require that you send, apparently by email, documents to prove identity/address (e.g., passport, utility bill) as does WorldRemit - a couple that I have checked on - the webpage is: https://www.finder.com/international-money-transfers/send-money-to-thailand?country_from=USA&country_to=THA&amount=1000

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Jun
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#22 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby Jun » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:53 am

Please note Transferwise have ZERO spread on their forex rate, so that $19 fee is all you pay. No other costs.

If I transfer £5000 from a British bank, the bank fee is about £30. They also have a forex spread. The total cost of the transaction is a tad over 3% (to a certain ASEAN country).

Does your US bank REALLY have zero spread on the forex ?

If yes, they are way less greedy than the UK banks.
I struggle to comprehend the concept of a bank that is not greedy, so if this is the scenario & you have zero spread, I apologize for the tone of questioning.

If the US bank has a spread, you need to add it in and calculate the total cost of the transaction.

In my case total cost goes from >3% to <0.5% (my money is going to another ASEAN country).

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#23 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby mahjongguy » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:38 am

Jun, please help me to understand your point about the originating bank having a spread.

If the bank is sending sterling or dollars, what spread are you referring to?

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#24 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby Jun » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:07 pm

Forgive me for using GBP as the example.

As I write, the mid-market GBP rate is 42.5756.
So for a zero- loss transaction, with £5,000 I should get 212,878 baht.
However, the bank is likely to only give me something like 41.4.
If I transfer £5000 to Thailand with my bank, I get 207,000.

If I wanted to change my baht back into GBP, then they might only give me a rate of 43.6, so I now have £4747.

So the spread is the difference in exchange rates. The difference in the buy and sell rate. Same as the numbers on the board in the airport.

When looking at transfers, I only ever compare the total cost. That includes the fees by my home bank, the spread on the forex and the receiving bank fee.

Actually, with stockbroking it's the same. Buy an overseas stock and your typical UK broker might charge £17. Not much on a £10,000 trade. However, they also take 1.5% on the forex, which is £150. Many supposedly sophisticated investors only discuss the £17 fee when comparing brokers & ignore the £150.

For your forex, try looking up your last transfer. See how much you had in dollars in the US and how much you got in baht in Thailand. Then look up the historic mid-market rate for that date on XE. Calculate how many baht you should have got. Then check the percentage difference between the 2 figures.
If it were a UK bank, the total is probably about 3%
Transferwise can get down to about 0.59%

Maybe the US banks are competitive with Transferwise, but the only way to know is to check the numbers.

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#25 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby mahjongguy » Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:25 pm

You made reference to mid-market rates, presumably from a forex site like XE. As you explained, those are not average Buy rates. They are the midpoint between the Buy and Sell rates at the moment, are only useful for trading, and only for transactions that occur offshore. If you send dollars or sterling to Thailand you get the TT Buy rate in effect at the receiving Thai bank at the time that the order is processed. You will never get the mid-market rate, you'll always get less, because you are Buying.

None of that has anything to do with the originating bank. They're not doing any exchange so they only get the wire fee. Unless, of course, they manage to talk their customer into letting them do the conversion first and then transfer baht. They entice with a lower fee and charge whatever exchange rate suits them.

I'm only picking on this point because I too often hear from friends about rates quoted on forex sites and those rates are not those which apply to the ex-pat who is bringing in home currency to be spent here as baht.

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#26 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby Jun » Fri Sep 07, 2018 10:03 pm

We never get the XE mid-market rate, but as exchange rates are dynamic, we need something to measure the percentage loss of our transaction against. Hence the use of the XE rate.

Of course the forex rate depends on the bank.
If I go to Transferwise, I pay the ~£20 fee and get the XE rate
If I go to my bank, they charge me £20~30 and take 2.5~5% off the forex rate and there may be charges by the receiving bank.

It's the same with ATM withdrawals.
Most UK banks charge 2.75~3% on foreign currency ATM withdrawals, including in Europe.
I believe Metrobank charge 1% in Europe.

With credit card transactions, the UK banks add on about 2.75~3% for overseas transactions. An exception is the Halifax Clarity Credit card, where the charge is zero.

So according to my way of operating you simply measure the efficiency of your transaction against the XE mid market rate.

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#27 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby 2lz2p » Sat Oct 06, 2018 3:22 pm

It appears that Social Security has the capability to send direct deposits using the IAT format - per several reports on the Thaivisa.com thread, some receive in the IAT format and others in PPD format (domestic ACH transfer) - further, you can ask Bangkok Bank branch to print out a detail listing for your direct deposit (social security or other) - it should have an SEC code that shows "IAT" or "PPD" - if the latter, Bangkok Bank is recommending you contact your pension provider (social security, Government agency, private company, etc.) to see if they can change to the IAT format. If from Social Security and it shows "IAT", then no problem as you should continue to receive the direct deposit after April 1, 2019. But, if it appears as "PPD" Social Security should be able to change the method from PPD to IAT.

One of the messages also included a copy of a Bangkok Bank letter, dated in October, that lists a contact person in their Headquarters Global Payments division that can look up the information for you -- Mrs. Supatra Phetchai, Global Payment Services Department - telephone 02-230-1323.

This information along with a link to and information on the specific messages that may be of interest (there are now more than 300 messages) on the Thaivisa.com thread are contained in the Pattaya City Expats Club Newsletter link: http://www.pcecnews.com/tmpNL/BANGKOK-BANK-NEW-YORK-FUNDS-TRANSFER-UPDATE.pdf

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#28 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby gera » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:23 am

DBS Singapore has now free same day transfers to any bank in Thailand. Exchange rates are OK but not great. Another drawback is the current limit for transfer is 1000 Singapore Dollars. I have an option of free transfer from my US bank to DBS. Unfortunately, it requires exchange of US Dollars to Singapore ones. Overall cost of transfer to Thailand using this route is en par with BKK bank route.

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#29 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby Gaybutton » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:46 pm

Received from a friend who wishes to remain anonymous:
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#30 Re: ACH transfers from USA to Bangkok Bank -Alert!

Postby Jun » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:29 am

gera wrote:DBS Singapore has now free same day transfers to any bank in Thailand. Exchange rates are OK but not great.

When you say the exchange rate is "not great", I presume you mean it's not mid market.

Therefore the transfer is not free, since there is a charge hidden in the exchange rate.

Anything that involves convincing yourself it's "free" but ignoring the exchange rate means the transaction has unknown losses, so we cannot compare it with any alternative options posted here.

The only rational & complete way to compare forex transactions is to consider the TOTAL costs for any transaction, including ALL fees and ALL costs due to poor exchange rates.


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